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Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by jeffbee on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @10:57AM (#32239211)
Battery buses are a solution ahead of their time. Any old bus is better than car-based transportation, so shifting modes from car to bus is more important than changing the energy source of the bus. If shifting from car to bus is impossible because of built environment, that's the first priority. Buses powered by batteries should be way down at the end of the TODO list.

If you absolutely insist on having buses that aren't direct sources of CO2, fuel cells are a more mature technology that makes more sense than batteries.

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by KaiserPro on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:23AM (#32239617)
I suspect that you don't live in europe.

In london, buses are a massive source of particulate and nitrogen pollution.

We've had hybrid buses for a good 5 years, some hydrogen ones as well (but only one or two routes)

However london has rolled out 100% electric buses in the last 3 years, and they've not caught fire at a faster rate than the diesel ones.

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by jeffbee on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:28AM (#32239666)
In London that makes sense because they already have a decent mode share. I suspect the bus mode share in Hamden, Connecticut is 1% or less.
Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by KaiserPro on Wednesday July 27, 2022 @04:20AM (#32248072)
for demand that makes sense, for justification of using EV or not, I don't think it really makes a difference.
Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by dumpsterlid on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:04AM (#32239339)
Yah precisely the point. We should focus on making busses comfy and nice and on getting good coverage with bus routes so that people use them.

Worry about them being electric later, the environmental impact of less people driving far overshadows the impact of ev vs gas busses.

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by velcrohacker on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @12:53PM (#32240793)
Any sources to support the claim that fuel cells are more mature?

Looking at another aspect, how many hydrogen generation facilities are there in CT, vs. facilities that can charge an electric bus?

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by throwaway0a5e on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:08AM (#32239395)
Buses and other "same route local delivery" type vehicles are a prime candidate for electrification TODAY because the short and known daily mileage plus always returning to the same spot at downtime sidesteps a lot of the range/charger problems that push EV to be just barely not viable enough for other cases.
Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by txsoftwaredev on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @02:27PM (#32241974)
A bus is only better if it is full of passengers, which is not always the case.
Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by absolutelynobo on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:07AM (#32239383)
The stunning failure of Nikola or any other large-scale fuel cell company other than Toyota to deliver working FC vehicles really calls into question your characterization of hydrogen as “more mature” than batteries. Every FC vehicle is also an EV, just FYI.

One would also wonder why China has ~0 fuel cell buses and tens of thousands of electric buses if FC is the more mature tech.

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by jeffbee on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:10AM (#32239435)
My city has a large fleet of fuel cell buses and has had them for over a decade, which suggests you don’t know what you are talking about.
Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by absolutelynobo on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:13AM (#32239490)
So you’re saying that the the unnamed town you’re in bought a few FC buses 10 years ago and is still maintaining them today? That’s great, but it’s also an anecdote.

Have they bought any recently? Have neighboring towns bought in as well?

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by jeffbee on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:18AM (#32239565)
I see that you are doubling down on the “don’t know what you’re talking about” aspect of this debate. My local transit agency is AC Transit. It serves millions of people in several large cities. Last year it ordered fifty more fuel cell vehicles from its suppliers.

https://www.actransit.org/zeb

Re:After bus fire, CT pulls electric fleet from service by absolutelynobo on Tuesday July 26, 2022 @11:28AM (#32239671)
Thank you for sharing that link, Jeff! It’s neat to see that ACT is going for a 70% hydrogen, 30% electric mix. Their page has a unbiased-sounding section on it:

> We will be running hydrogen and battery electric vehicles in identical service to collect real-world performance data for comparison—and to determine which technology performs better to meet the needs of our service as we move towards a complete zero-emission fleet by 2040.

It looks like they started the hydrogen bus project 20 years ago, not ten.