Re:Online hackers threaten to expose cartel's secrets
by viraptor on Monday October 31, 2011 @05:14AM
(#3176823)
Regarding Amsterdam... I don't get the "most Dutch people wouldn't be seen in the red light district". It's not like it's some small place; it spans many streets in the centre and I haven't seen anyone avoiding it - whether it's locals or tourists. From what I heard, not many local people care much if they're there or not, it's just a part of the city. Of course you can smell cannabis in half of the streets, but otherwise I felt more secure there in a red-light district at night, than in some areas of Birmingham during the day. Although it's hard to find exactly corresponding stats, most are indicating little crime in Amsterdam compared to similar cities in many other countries.
Re:Online hackers threaten to expose cartel's secrets
by brc on Tuesday November 01, 2011 @03:57AM
(#3181098)
I was talking about the Dutch population as a whole, not the subset who live in Amsterdam.
Yes, it's a safe city although late at night there can be some dodgy characters walking around looking for stoned tourists to relieve of cash whether by scam or by force.
Speak to a dutch person about going there, you'll soon understand what I mean. Most don't go anywhere near it. It's not that it's taboo, it's more that it is seriously uncool. Think about it - who hangs around in obviously touristy bars in their own city?
Re:Online hackers threaten to expose cartel's secrets
by hobolobo on Monday October 31, 2011 @08:48AM
(#3177193)
I think a more pertinent example would be Portugal, which decriminalised all drugs in 2001. Glenn Greenwald of the Cato Institute said
"Judging by every metric, decriminalization in Portugal has been a resounding success."
A couple of links for those interested in learning more:
http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.ht...
and
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tomchivers/100047485/po...
The problem you have is that relaxing of the laws has to happen gradually and simltaneously.
If one country or state or even town drops the drug laws, it gets overrun with the worst case scenario, as the very desperate flock to that region. The region then becomes a poster child for the 'I told you so's who will point at addicts, mess, and whatever external effects will come from that. If it is experimented and ends up in very public failure, the topic will be removed from discussion for a generation.
This is partially the case in Amsterdam, where most Dutch people wouldn't be seen in the red light district, as it is overrun with drug and sex tourists, usually from other countries. And do-gooders point to the Amsterdam red-light district and say 'see, do you want your town like that?', despite the fact that the laws are not Amsterdam specific, and apply to the country as a whole. And the rest of the country is a very pleasant place to be.
So you need to relax laws slowly and simultaneously, so that the problems can be dealt with as they arise, and successful health management can be introduced at the same time. And you have to take a very realistic view of the societal damage drug use can cause, no matter what type (ie beer or heroin).
Given these requirements, I can't see it ever happening in the foreseeable future, which pretty much guarantees the cartels will exist for a long time, possibly until they capture an entire nation and form an actual government.
EDIT: Just remembered a great line from the Ben Elton book (whose name I have forgotten) which is about removing drug laws.
The quote is something like : "Do you really care if another person becomes a heroin addict if it means your Grandma will not get mugged on the way home"
Really, it's all about people not trying to always rule and control the lives of others.