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Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by cryptoz on Friday October 21, 2011 @02:34PM (#3141043)
Comparing last year's Android with this year's iOS? Why not wait three weeks and compare recent iOS and recent Android?

I think it's common knowledge Google didn't work terribly hard on getting a smooth UI until ICS. I'm an Android dev and I fully understand the "smoothness" of iOS is attractive, but it's a bit unfair of a comparison to make at this time - using an iPhone 4S.

Yes, I know the 4S is shipping and the Galaxy Nexus is not - that much I'll give. But this is only a month-long window and not very reflective of the coming future.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by masklinn on Friday October 21, 2011 @03:50PM (#3141359)
> Comparing last year's Android with this year's iOS?

You could make that comparison using any iOS and any iPhone combination apart from iPhone 3G + iOS 4. It's not new to the 4S, although the 4S probably pulls even further ahead, this issue has been a recurring theme in Android phone reviews ever since the first Android phone was released.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Friday October 21, 2011 @04:41PM (#3141589)
I'm amazed no one's mentioned this yet. it's not just hardware acceleration that's the problem with Android. it's the garbage collection constantly running in the background that's causing some of the performance issues and lag. Now with ICS I read that it will allow the garbage collector to run on a different core from your application. that's definitely going to improve performance, but the overhead is still there. No wonder Android smartphones need 1.x GHZ and 1GB of RAM. Android needs it.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by ZeroGravitas on Saturday October 22, 2011 @03:44AM (#3143103)
The Android devs mentioned this themselves in the very first comment on the bug about turning on GPU acceleration[1]. But the internet decided that GPU acceleration was the silver bullet, and now it's been turned on they're surprised that it's not.

And this is somehow further evidence of Google's incompetence (and/or lack of taste) rather than just the obvious result of a bunch of engineering tradeoffs that, if you look at Android marketshare and Google's resultant influence on the future of the web, seem to have worked out quite well for them.

[1] http://code.google.com/p/android/issues/detail?id=6914#c1

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Saturday October 22, 2011 @05:39PM (#3144388)
What Google should've done is disable the garbage collector in Android/Dalvik the same way Apple did in iOS/Obj C. I don't know whether it's lack of foresight or incompetence on the part of Google, or maybe they were in a hurry to launch Android they didn't have time to re-architect the thing. Garbage collection exists in MAC OS X/Obj C btw.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by nitrogen on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:01PM (#3141911)
No wonder Android smartphones need 1.x GHZ and 1GB of RAM. Android needs it.

The side effect of having all that extra CPU is that, when not running the core Android UI (e.g. a game written mostly in native code), a lot more power is available to developers.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:17PM (#3141962)
garbage collection is not limited to the UI. Games, etc. everything's affected by this. this is partly a Java "issue".
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by ibisum on Sunday October 23, 2011 @05:14AM (#3145674)
If you write your game properly using the NDK you won't incur any GC at all. Its quite possible to achieve zero-collection this way.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by wbkang on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:28PM (#3141998)
Is there any evidence that suggest this? I have seen people saying this against desktop Java applications as well but mostly the unresponsiveness is caused by bad programming not GC. The GC process runs mostly in sub-milliseconds and you will never notice this.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:42PM (#3142042)
it's a widely known issues.

If you allocate objects in a user interface loop, you will force a periodic garbage collection, creating little "hiccups" in the user experience. The concurrent collector introduced in Gingerbread helps, but unnecessary work should always be avoided. http://developer.android.com/guide/practices/design/performa...

Why should I avoid garbage collection? When Dalvik does a GC, most of the time your game will have to wait until the garbage collection is complete. It will often take in the order of 100 milliseconds to complete. Doesn’t sound like much but in your game loop this is huge – causing a horrible stutter or lack of responsiveness. http://fanitis.com/2011/02/09/android-game-performance-garba...

Garbage collection and async operations frequently block UI rendering. http://www.satine.org/archives/2011/01/01/the-care-and-feedi...

Android Garbage Collector Slow Down http://stackoverflow.com/questions/6742314/android-garbage-c...

I'm performance tuning interactive games in Java for the Android platform. Once in a while there is a hiccup in drawing and interaction for garbage collection. Usually it's less than one tenth of a second, but sometimes it can be as large as 200ms on very slow devices. http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2484079/how-can-i-avoid-g...

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by pixie_ on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:54PM (#3142072)
Exactly. I tried to mention the bad performance of the GC earlier. You can find my post and the very bottom.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:58PM (#3142089)
rofl @pixie they down voted you.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by chugger on Friday October 21, 2011 @04:52PM (#3141647)
another note:

iOS/Obj C does not do automatic garbage collection specifically for this reason (and battery life).

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by krobertson on Friday October 21, 2011 @04:25PM (#3141511)
1) Having gone iPhone -> Android -> iPhone, I've always found the overall fluidity better on the iPhone. This isn't anything new in iOS 5. I believe it comes from the solid hardware and OS marriage. Android has too much variation that consistent performance across models is harder.

2) While Gingerbread is "last year's Android", it is still being shipped on new phones... or not even shipping yet. Android is cursed with a slow process for updates with the manufacturers and carriers. My Thunderbolt never got Gingerbread (from the carrier, sure I did root it) and it just came out and then was pulled.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by wbkang on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:30PM (#3142011)
Absolutely. Last year's iPhones will be running this year's iOS. Last year's Androids will, most likely, never receive this year's Android (unless, of course if you are lucky enough to get working custom ROMs ported to your devices).
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by vorbby on Friday October 21, 2011 @03:26PM (#3141256)
For the problems he's talking about, I would make this point:

From my experience, after taking away features and just focusing on user experience, iOS 1.0 beats Android 2.x in nearly every category. Even back then, everything just worked on iOS.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by wvenable on Friday October 21, 2011 @03:07PM (#3141179)
Yes, but the same comparison could be made with last year's Android and iOS4. For smoothness of UI, even the original iPhone was smooth.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by fondue on Friday October 21, 2011 @11:27PM (#3142647)
No it wasn't; I own an iPhone 3G and it stalls and stutters doing anything. It's consistently done that for the entirety of its service. My wife bought the 3GS and _that_ was when we saw much of the UI lag go away.

I moved on to Android and own a Galaxy S - there's virtually no UI stutter at all, I only see delays on shutting some programs or launching a few apps. My wife recently bought a 4S and it's very smooth, but don't tell me that iOS has always been this smooth because you're looking back with rose-colored glasses.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by SahilDesai on Friday October 21, 2011 @04:42PM (#3141595)
It probably would have been a lot fairer had he compared the iPhone 3GS or iPhone 4 to everything pre-ICS (AKA any android phone on the market). In which case, any iOS device would still win.

We'll have to see how ICS on (Android device) holds up against iOS 5 on 4S.

Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by jsz0 on Friday October 21, 2011 @06:13PM (#3141948)
Problem is, due to the way Android is distributed, the vast majority of Android phones won't have ICS until mid-to-late 2012. There are still a couple popular phones like the Droid Incredible that don't even have the Gingerbread update yet. At this point we don't even know which carriers are going to be offering the Galaxy Nexuses or exactly when it will be released.
Re:After the iPhone 4S, Android just feels wrong by sardonicbryan on Saturday October 22, 2011 @03:22AM (#3143076)
I know this likely doesn't apply to the average Joe, but I'm sure that I will have ICS running on my Galaxy S2 within a month or so, once the custom ROMs start getting stable.