> the EU didn't embody the principles it claimed to stand for (and of which I approved).
But is it possible that you were holding it to a higher standard than you hold your own country to?
> Moderating the atavistic instincts of other countries isn't a good reason for being in a political union.
Turning that around, though: reducing the moderation on those atavistic instincts is not a good way to further the principles you claim to support. In any case, there are other, more positive, reasons to be an international trade and peace agreement than just a duty to look out for your neighbours.
> I have half a chance of voting them out. It's not possible to vote Hungary and Poland off the EU Commission.
But the problem isn't the nationality of the commissioners, because you're not a racist, right? The Council of Ministers only nominates the various members of the Commission, in agreement with the nominated President, and the 27 members as a team are then subject to a vote of approval by the European Parliament.[0] So you had more chance of voting out an atavistic Hungarian or Polish commissioner (through your MEP, and President) than you had of determining the composition of Boris Johnson's cabinet (especially considering the more proportional voting system used by the EU).
> Greece acceded despite not meeting the financial requirements for membership; it was then financially crushed by Germany (more specifically, German bankers)
If Greece did not meet the financial requirements, it is because of fraud carried out by Greece itself, without the EU's knowledge[1]. Greece abusing its position in the Eurozone to leverage itself into an unsustainable economic position is not something you need to be ashamed of, no matter the nationality of the bankers who were Greece's creditors.
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Commission
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Greece#Eurozone_ent...
That's not right, in practice. Each member government appoints a commissioner. The Council of Ministers is nothing more than an ad-hoc meeting of relevant ministers from member governments, whose membership varies depending on what is being discussed. The parliament always approves all the proposed commissioners. The parliament can dismiss a commissioner, but only by dismissing the entire commission. This has only ever happened once, when it became obvious that most of them were crooks.
> fraud carried out by Greece itself, without the EU's knowledge
There was "fraud" by Greece; they weren't prepared to balance their budget. But actually everyone knew about it; it wasn't fraud in the sense of covert shenanigans. Government budgets tend to be public information. Germany, in particular, wanted Greece to accede.
What do you mean by that, exactly? Because EU votes are only proportional by country; each country is allocated a fixed number of seats based on its population, and each country only votes for its own representation. A UK vote has zero effect on the Hungarian MEP distribution.
Actually, to be clear, I haven't compared the Gallagher index[0] values of UK general elections and UK elections of MEPs, so I accept the possibility that quirks of the two systems and the UK political scene might mean that the real world outcomes don't match the theory.
Of course not. Rules get broken all the time. But as the years went by, I came to realise that the EU didn't embody the principles it claimed to stand for (and of which I approved).
> Leaving the EU doesn't help make Hungary (for example) become any less authoritarian
Moderating the atavistic instincts of other countries isn't a good reason for being in a political union.
> Boris Johnson and the Tories
I have half a chance of voting them out. It's not possible to vote Hungary and Poland off the EU Commission.
The fact is, we're out; I voted to leave; I'm not regretful. I knew there would be consequences. They've not been as severe as I expected (yet).
I generally avoid debating Brexit with people; it's done and dusted. When it was still a live debate it was VERY divisive, because EU membership embraces so many aspects of life and politics. It's almost impossible to win (or lose) a Brexit debate.
But I'm not ashamed of my decision, so I'm prepared to stand up and defend it. I think a renewed Brexit debate would be off-topic here, though.
FTR, I have nothing against Poles or Hungarians. Their governments have never been aligned with what I thought were the EU principles, though. Greece acceded despite not meeting the financial requirements for membership; it was then financially crushed by Germany (more specifically, German bankers). That did cause me shame.