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Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by zmgsabst on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:38PM (#31226931)
Yuck.

I’m sick of living in a society where wealthy people are able to bully and harass others.

No corporation would feel bound to honor a price tossed out casually in an email with nothing signed — and it’s disgusting they’re suing an old man to bully him.

Why is it crypto people are so gross? — how can I take the current state of crypto seriously when a “major” platform acts like petulant middle schoolers?

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by gruez on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:45PM (#31226983)
>Why is it crypto people are so gross? — how can I take the current state of crypto seriously when a “major” platform acts like petulant middle schoolers?

see: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fundamental_attribution_error

People/companies suing people over domains isn't new. See for instance, nissan.com

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by moron4hire on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:52PM (#31227062)
So what?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by gruez on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:03PM (#31227196)
I was refuting the parent comment. If you have trouble understanding the significance/consequence of that act, or that "so what?" is an adequate reply to that, then it's clear that engaging with you is not worth my time.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by moron4hire on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:10PM (#31227285)
But it's not a refutation at all
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by gruez on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:23PM (#31227391)
1. maybe next time you should make a more substantive comment rather than something vague like "so what?"

2. What is a refutation then? The OP was the equivalent of getting cut off by a BMW, then lamenting how BMW drivers are "are so gross" and how you can them seriously when they "acts like petulant middle schoolers". If you don't think that counts as a refutation, what does?

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by moron4hire on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:40PM (#31227519)
Yes, it's clear you don't know what a refutation is. "B is also Y" does not falsify "A is Y". OP never said "crypto is uniquely scummy" and you did not say "crypto is not scummy".

The problem is that crypto advocates will spend all day bending your ear about how crypto is necessary for the good of humanity, and then as soon as you point out any of the bad shit happening, claim no honorable intentions were ever claimed, the existing system sucks anyway, get over it, buy my token loser.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by gruez on Sunday May 01, 2022 @03:22PM (#31227851)
>Yes, it's clear you don't know what a refutation is. "B is also Y" does not falsify "A is Y".

linguistic descriptivism to the rescue!

https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/refute

>2. (transitive, proscribed) To deny the truth or correctness of (something).

>Usage notes

>The second meaning of refute (“to deny the truth of”) is proscribed as erroneous by some (compare Merriam Webster,1994). An alternative term with such a meaning is repudiate, which means to reject or refuse to acknowledge, but without the implication of justification. However, this distinction does not exist in the original Latin refūtō (“oppose, resist, rebut”), which can apply to both senses.

That said, I'll concede that it's not strictly not a refutation, because I don't think it's ultimately relevant to the conversation.

>The problem is that crypto advocates will spend all day bending your ear about how crypto is necessary for the good of humanity, and then as soon as you point out any of the bad shit happening, claim no honorable intentions were ever claimed, the existing system sucks anyway, get over it, buy my token loser.

I don't understand what your point here is. Are you claiming that Jump Trading or their leadership engages in the behavior that you mentioned? Or are you simply noting that there's crypto companies/people doing shady stuff?

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by robertlagrant on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:27PM (#31227428)
You haven't demonstrated how your analogy is useful. OP's statement wasn't from a single instance of wrongdoing.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by gruez on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:33PM (#31227468)
>OP's statement wasn't from a single instance of wrongdoing.

He didn't list or make any explicit reference to any other instances. The entirety of the comment consists of:

1. assertion that "crypto people are so gross"

2. claiming that the actions of "a “major” platform" (singular) causes him to be unable to take current state of crypto seriously

>You haven't demonstrated how your analogy is useful.

Maybe BMW driver are actually "so gross", but on a forum like HN I expect more arguments backing that than just a reference to the current story.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by robertlagrant on Sunday May 01, 2022 @03:17PM (#31227818)
> on a forum like HN I expect more arguments backing that than just a reference to the current story

Your expectations aren't likely to be met if you spend time on fallacies instead of just writing one line asking for more evidence as to why crypto people are gross.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by JaimeThompson on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:56PM (#31227099)
>Why is it crypto people are so gross?

They are desperate to become the new middle men so they fight dirty.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by criddell on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:49PM (#31227033)
> Why is it crypto people are so gross?

Yeah, I don’t get how they see this as a good move.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by sacrosancty on Sunday May 01, 2022 @03:34PM (#31227962)
To be fair, he bullied them first by lying about his offer, even insisting that it was "firm" when it really wasn't at all. Those people are assholes when they win their smaller-scale bullying game. He just happens to have barked at a bigger dog than himself.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by ericd on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:19PM (#31227356)
Jump Trading was founded in 1999, they’re traditional finance people, not “crypto people”.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by nneonneo on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:25PM (#31227411)
They’re buying this domain solely to use it for their wormhole network, which bridges blockchains together. So, in this context, they most definitely are “crypto people”.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by ericd on Sunday May 01, 2022 @06:31PM (#31229378)
I know it’s for a crypto related project, I read the article, but I’d argue that the average finance person adding another asset class that they trade is substantially different from the archetype that most would describe as “crypto people”.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by siftrics on Sunday May 01, 2022 @09:32PM (#31230477)
They are absolutely "crypto people." They have had nigh the most crypto engineering power of any firm in the entire world for like 5-6 years now. They have literally hundreds of extremely smart people who have been in crypto since the beginning.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by ericd on Monday May 02, 2022 @01:22PM (#31238035)
Ah ok, thanks for the context! The people I know in hedge funds are far away from being what most would think of as crypto people, but perhaps Jump is a bit of an exception.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by pgwhalen on Sunday May 01, 2022 @07:16PM (#31229675)
Most crypto people are traditional finance people at this point, this is lost in a lot of conversation about crypto.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by j4yav on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:24PM (#31227399)
They seem to have since then moved to operating in crypto (tfa says they want the domain for their crypto business).
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by t_mann on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:53PM (#31227068)
Why is it crypto people are so gross?

Sorry to shatter your illusions, that's not specific to crypto at all. Disney lawyers are far less child-friendly than the company's content, and so is pretty much every major corporation. Just this week, I remember Zara (the fashion retailer) sueing a one-woman-run boutique named House of Zana. A bit before they also sued a women's empowerment business called Tara Sartorial (yes, because of likeness of the names). The number of tiny independents that Jack Wolfskin has sued for putting anything resembling an animal footprint onto pretty much any fabric is countless. We could go on here.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by zmgsabst on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:57PM (#31227127)
I don’t see how outlining other gross behavior makes crypto people less gross.

Eg, Disney is currently suffering major financial losses due to being associated with child grooming and trying to overturn democratically passed laws.

Is your point that I should accept the grotesquery of a major company suing an old man because others behave badly?

…How does that make sense?

> Sorry to shatter your illusions, that's not specific to crypto at all.

This is also a petty ad hominem that requires an uncharitable assumption about me.

Far from shattering my “illusions”, you just revealed your own cynicism and low standards.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by t_mann on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:05PM (#31227220)
So do you have issues taking fashion retailers seriously because major players act like "petulant middle schoolers" (your words)? Do you have problems taking pretty much every economic sector seriously because major players act in an incredibly petty way heaping frightening lawsuits on unwitting individuals? Or are you just holding crypto companies to a different standard because you have other reservations about the sector?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by JaimeThompson on Sunday May 01, 2022 @07:41PM (#31229807)
>Disney is currently suffering major financial losses due to being associated with child grooming and trying to overturn democratically passed laws.

>This is also a petty ad hominem that requires an uncharitable assumption about me.

The contrast between those two statements is most interesting.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by zmgsabst on Sunday May 01, 2022 @10:03PM (#31230656)
How so?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by JaimeThompson on Monday May 02, 2022 @08:24AM (#31234203)
How, because I misread what you wrote and didn't reread it when I wrote what I said. I totally took what you said incorrectly for that I apologize.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by 0x4d464d48 on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:10PM (#31227284)
"Why is it crypto people are so gross?"

https://corporatefinanceinstitute.com/resources/knowledge/ot...

Because some people do not give a fuck. We're talking about people who support valuation of assets based on speculation with no actual economic value while pumping out oceans of CO2 and wasting copious amounts of energy to have computers, to simplify a bit, guess a number somewhere between 0 and 2^255 for the privelege.

Seems on brand.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by everyone on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:03PM (#31227202)
"Why is it crypto people are so gross?" They're conmen running a scam, they're gonna be super gross of course.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by TAForObvReasons on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:43PM (#31226973)
> Merryman responded on July 1: “The price for wormhole.com is a firm US $ 50,000. -Dick-.”

> Merryman hadn’t been serious about selling, he said, throwing out what he viewed as a high offer to get them to go away.

If he wasn't serious about selling, he should have said so and moved on. It seems smarmy to quote an offer price without a sincere intent to sell.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by netram88 on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:52PM (#31227059)
>It seems smarmy to quote an offer price without a sincere intent to sell.

Merryman is 79, and receiving emails about selling the domain he's owned for decades. He has never asked for these emails, and just wants to be left alone. He throws a highball offer, hoping they'll go away. He then clarifies that he doesn't want to sell, which he is of course fully allowed to do. Then they sue him.

I would say there are smarmy actions in here, but not on the part of Merryman.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by shepardrtc on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:02PM (#31227183)
> He then clarifies that he doesn't want to sell

He increased the price to 100k, then 200k, then said no.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by Jaepa on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:56PM (#31227105)
I think he was serious about selling it. But he was so severely low-balled initially that he doesn't trust Jump to give him a fair price.

Jump's original bid is 2,500 dollars.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by juancb on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:55PM (#31227093)
Perhaps a more direct "fuck off" would have been better?

View it from the eyes of a guy that retired in 2001, or any reasonable person, and $50k for a domain is an absurd amount that should have been tantamount to "I'm not selling, take off."

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by rosndo on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:57PM (#31227119)
>or any reasonable person

There are many reasonable people who understand that $50k is nothing for a decent domain name.

Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by cbozeman on Sunday May 01, 2022 @04:34PM (#31228411)
And I guarantee you there are far more reasonable people who don't.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by mr_toad on Sunday May 01, 2022 @08:39PM (#31230172)
Not knowing what something is worth won’t get you out of a contract.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by boesboes on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:49PM (#31227029)
I dunno, as long as there is no contract I dont see why he can’t reconsider. I mean, offers are retracted all the time
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by djohnston on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:47PM (#31227006)
Sure, that's the most you can say. Without a signed agreement he has no obligation to listen to them or sell.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by rosndo on Sunday May 01, 2022 @02:18PM (#31227344)
Why would an email not be an agreement?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by djohnston on Sunday May 01, 2022 @05:19PM (#31228766)
Its not legally binding, are you asking why an email isn't legally binding?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by rosndo on Sunday May 01, 2022 @06:19PM (#31229268)
Yeah, why not?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by ipaddr on Sunday May 01, 2022 @06:57PM (#31229556)
Because a window isn't a door
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by rosndo on Sunday May 01, 2022 @08:02PM (#31229927)
So you don’t actually know?
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by AdmiralAsshat on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:47PM (#31227007)
"smarmy" is not illegal. It's also not a binding contract.
Re:Jump Trading sues 79-year-old Carl Sagan fan over wormhol... by copperx on Sunday May 01, 2022 @01:51PM (#31227054)
I think we've found the potential buyer.