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Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by lotsofpulp on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:18AM (#30601634)
The societal risks are the same with additional worse effects for non participants with alcohol and they have been known for a long time. If society is OK with those risks, then I cannot see cannabis being an unacceptable risk in 50 years. Can throw in refined sugar too.
Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:21AM (#30601664)
> The societal risks are the same and additional worse ones with alcohol

I don't think this is correct, personally.

(I'm pretty sure you'll find studies arguing for both sides, so we can only go on personal wisdom.)

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by lotsofpulp on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:26AM (#30601754)
Would you rather deal with someone high on cannabis or drunk on alcohol?

To collect data, visit all the hotels, restaurants, bars, police, security guards, and entertainment venues in your area and ask all the front line employees this question. Or even who you would rather drive around.

I guarantee everyone would rather deal with someone high on cannabis, who might ask for extra snacks or drive slow and be unlikely to go on a belligerent tirade or get physical.

In terms of other societal risks, I have not heard of a cannabis addict beating their spouse or children yet.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by adamsmith143 on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @05:40PM (#30608295)
But omg cannabis users get so lazy and have no motivation... /s
Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:55PM (#30611088)
Nobody's arguing that.
Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by adamsmith143 on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:24AM (#30601713)
It's not even comparable. You an ignore the fact that far more people use Alcohol regularly, that it has countless other deleterious health affects and just look at pure death rates directly attributable to Alcohol. It's just not even in the same universe.

>(I'm pretty sure you'll find studies arguing for both sides, so we can only go on personal wisdom.)

This is blatantly false. Find me 1 study that shows definitively that MJ is worse than Alcohol for society.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @12:55PM (#30603151)
You're being aggressive. Please stop.

I wouldn't contest that more people die from alcohol than marajuana. That wasn't the issue under discussion. The issue is, which is worse for society.

Part of why I find your comment so aggressive is because you're being very sharp with me, but you don't realize you aren't talking about the same thing.

> This is blatantly false. Find me 1 study that shows definitively that MJ is worse than Alcohol for society.

Having worked in academia as a researcher, I don't actually believe studies can reliably be understood by anyone other than those who conducted it and their immediate peers in the field.

A weaker form of that, which I also agree with, would be, "studies are rarely definitive." But you're asking for a definitive study. That doesn't seem fair.

Anyway, it isn't incumbent on me to do the work for you that you are asking me to do.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by adamsmith143 on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @05:38PM (#30608272)
>You're being aggressive. Please stop.

If my comment is what you consider to be overly aggressive maybe you need to get out more.

All research is BS therefore opinion is king is one of the weakest arguments I have ever heard.

BTW your not so subtle digs are uncalled for.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:54PM (#30611084)
Flagged.
Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by ska on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @12:20PM (#30602578)
> I'm pretty sure you'll find studies arguing for both sides, so we can only go on personal wisdom.

Without opinion on the relative damage of both, I'll note that considering this a logical statement is really flawed.

You can pretty much always find "studies arguing for both sides" on an issue, but that doesn't mean much in and of itself.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @12:50PM (#30603056)
> Without opinion on the relative damage of both, I'll note that considering this a logical statement is really flawed.

I can't understand what you are saying here.

> You can pretty much always find "studies arguing for both sides" on an issue, but that doesn't mean much in and of itself.

Just trying to cut off the expected "studies show X" comments before they get started. Because if studies aren't definitive, which they rarely are, there isn't any point in raising that. And a simpler way to explain this is "studies conflict."

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by ska on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @06:40PM (#30608933)
> I can't understand what you are saying here.

My point was that you are actually very rarely in the case that studies are in conflict to the point that the best you can do is personal experience. It's the exception, not the rule.

To paraphrase Churchill: science is the worst system we have for understanding these sorts of things, except for all the others.

Re:Lead exposure in last century shrunk IQ scores of half of... by javert on Tuesday March 08, 2022 @11:56PM (#30611096)
> My point was that you are actually very rarely in the case that studies are in conflict to the point that the best you can do is personal experience

I didn't make my point very clearly, but my actual view is that only the researchers who perform a study and their immediate scientific peers are able to determine whether a study is reliable and what conclusions can actually be drawn from it. I say this as someone who worked in academic research.

> To paraphrase Churchill: science is the worst system we have for understanding these sorts of things, except for all the others.

Preaching to the choir, there. I'm not arguing against science.