Re:The data are clear: The boys are not all right
by 6figurelenins on Thursday February 10, 2022 @06:26AM
(#30284774)
It's in the definition, and predates "jordan peterson" by about a hundred years.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collectivism#Origins_and_histo...
> One could just as easily state as absolute fact that subsuming the individual to the societal unit is at the heart of the greatest accomplishments of humankind.
Do you have a benevolent dictator in mind?
> complete subjugation of free will
The fundamental problem of religion (politics, generally) is that you agree to submit to an all-merciful, all-benevolent, all-knowing entity. The reality of the deal is rather less satisfying.
Re:The data are clear: The boys are not all right
by btilly on Thursday February 10, 2022 @04:01PM
(#30292451)
Sure. If you read Enlightenment Now you'll find several chapters devoted to how many of the horrors of the 20th century can be traced back to ideologies which subsume the individual into groupings involving some subset of ethnic group, nationality, and social class. They are doubly dangerous if they are then paired with utopian ideals. Because if the ends justify the means, and the ends are a perfect good, you can rationalize ay horror.
You can find similar points of view in many previous writers from points as distant in the ideological spectrum as George Orwell and Ayn Rand.
Do you have anything other than the jordan peterson paraphrase to back this as a cause, as opposed to the actual dangerous ideologies? One could just as easily state as absolute fact that subsuming the individual to the societal unit is at the heart of the greatest accomplishments of humankind.
This idea is a straightforward false dichotomy presenting the only alternative to absolute individual liberty as complete subjugation of free will, and used to provide some truly absurd explanations for things, such as 'honor' being the actual problem in this case, not the 'killings'