News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Economists are revising their views on robots and jobs by zozbot234 on Tuesday January 25, 2022 @10:12PM (#30081207)
> The benefits of those efficiency improvements are already going to the owners of the capital, not to workers, and this has been going on for decades. If in 1980 you were able to replace 4 clerks handwriting transactions in an accounting ledger with one clerk typing them into a spreadsheet but pay that one clerk marginally more than a handwriting clerk, who benefits most in that equation?

The effect of productivity improvements on the real incomes of workers ultimately depend on how the change affects productivity of the marginal worker. You need to look at more than a single firm to figure this out. If the availability of spreadsheets makes clerical workers so much more productive that overall demand for their services increases more than four-fold (which might be definitely possible), the marginal spreadsheet-tweaking activity will be paid quite a lot, and workers' income will increase.

Re:Economists are revising their views on robots and jobs by oneoff786 on Tuesday January 25, 2022 @11:17PM (#30081634)
That doesn’t match real world outcomes though. Quantity demanded goes down. Wages go down.

Mostly because automation isn’t making that person more valuable, it’s just removing it from that persons role. Skilled labor becomes unskilled labor. Supply goes way up. Clerks are a great example.

They used to do a lot for a store and had to know all the products. Now a clerk is just a last mile button presser. They don’t add much value at all. They’re not doing 4x the work. They’re doing 0.1x the work. Trying to say “but the value couldn’t be captured without that guy” is wishful thinking.

Re:Economists are revising their views on robots and jobs by Talanes on Wednesday January 26, 2022 @12:04AM (#30081958)
> They used to do a lot for a store and had to know all the products. Now a clerk is just a last mile button presser. They don’t add much value at all. They’re not doing 4x the work. They’re doing 0.1x the work. Trying to say “but the value couldn’t be captured without that guy” is wishful thinking.

Not to detract from your overall point, which is absolutely correct, but having been a grocery clerk there's a slightly different phenomenon in play there. Having a clerk who knows the products well is a big help, but you really only need one available at a time. So rather than make acquiring that knowledge an actual part of the job, they rely on scale to have enough workers who learn it through their own initiative.

Re:Economists are revising their views on robots and jobs by zozbot234 on Wednesday January 26, 2022 @10:02AM (#30086296)
> Skilled labor becomes unskilled labor.

Which is bad for skilled labor (wrt. that set of skills) but good for unskilled labor.

Re:Economists are revising their views on robots and jobs by diordiderot on Thursday January 27, 2022 @01:49AM (#30097070)
It's not good for unskilled labor because they get paid even less than unskilled labor as prices rise and wages stagnate.