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Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by gnicholas on Wednesday January 19, 2022 @10:43PM (#30004280)
> All children will benefit from small class sizes, individualized lesson plans, encouragement to pursue their passions, etc etc.

Class size has nothing to do with it. As I've mentioned above multiple times, this is not what we are after. It is also not necessarily something that these programs offer; the program I was in 30 years ago did not have small class sizes.

Equally important, evidence does not strongly support the theory that smaller class sizes improve performance. Most of the studies show no benefit or a small benefit but only for certain types of students (white/Asian, not URM).

Similarly, we're not looking for individualized lesson plans. Just let her do the regular math for a different grade level. No customization needed. I realize that would require matching up 'math time' for her class and another class, but this is a school with 7 classes per grade. There are many ways to make this happen (for her and for other students who could also benefit from above-grade-level instruction).

> I do think on the whole G&T programs are a net negative- if only because they have drained so many resources from the vast majority of students.

> Its heartbreaking that we offer those services primarily to children who are academically exceptional.

I'm curious where you're getting your numbers from. I work in education technology, and the common wisdom is that tons of money is spent on Title I schools and special education. I have literally never heard anyone claim that GATE is a lucrative market.

Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by Misdicorl on Wednesday January 19, 2022 @11:47PM (#30004783)
Re spending: Every advanced class I was in had

1) a lower student to teacher ratio 2) better, newer equipment 3) better, more experienced teachers

I've never talked to someone who didn't admit to those advantages, only argued about how important they were or how expensive they might be. I can imagine it isn't a cash cow for the industry because the number of students is small and most of the difference is in teacher pay per child.

Re snap class sizes having an effect on outcomes. This is extremely surprising to me. The last I looked (admittedly quite some time ago) it was essentially the only factor that has significant weight and was reproducible.

Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by WalterBright on Thursday January 20, 2022 @02:54AM (#30006045)
> better, more experienced teachers

Well, you will need teachers who have mastered algebra themselves. Other than that, I don't see why they need to be better or more experienced.

The profs I had in college were never trained as teachers, nor were they particularly experienced at it. But they knew the material to the point that it was trivial for them.

Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by MaxBarraclough on Thursday January 20, 2022 @08:03AM (#30008356)
> But they knew the material to the point that it was trivial for them

On the flipside this can make it harder for the teacher to relate to the students. In a university context of course, students have each other as equals.

Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by jcranmer on Wednesday January 19, 2022 @11:33PM (#30004679)
> I'm curious where you're getting your numbers from. I work in education technology, and the common wisdom is that tons of money is spent on Title I schools and special education. I have literally never heard anyone claim that GATE is a lucrative market.

I went to a magnet school for high school. While we did have a decent amount of swanky equipment for labs, that was pretty much all donated or begged off of companies. That does comport with your tales that GT isn't particularly graced with extra funding.

Re:What it means to teach gifted learners well by WalterBright on Thursday January 20, 2022 @02:55AM (#30006050)
Swanky equipment is entirely unnecessary for GT instruction. All that is needed is a teacher and a blackboard.