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Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by pessimizer on Friday November 05, 2021 @05:44PM (#29125041)
> Decentralization seems to work well for cases where individuals are privately interacting with other users they already know. It seems much more difficult to solve the problem of public forum websites where anyone can contribute content.

But these don't actually need to exist. Decentralization doesn't have to mean a flat hierarchy, it could (against all trends) be a hierarchy with the user at the top, as social media once looked like. I could select the content I want to see by selecting the people that I trust and the content that they approve of, provisionally trusting the people that the people I trust also trust, and maybe extending that to an arbitrary number of hops. In that way I can choose my own mods.

This requires clients that work for the user rather than for the content creator, complete anathema to major browser vendors, who divide their time between anti-features to force their users to do things that they wouldn't want to do if given a choice, and candy for website owners/developers.

Labeling spam should punish the connections that caused it to be surfaced. That might damage serendipity slightly, but the modern web has run a bulldozer over serendipity with its engagement metrics algorithmically curating newsfeeds.

edit: one of the reasons I want (and probably many want) this kind of control is because I don't want spam, but I do want abuse. I don't want angry people filtered out as a rule, I want to be able to make the decision to blacklist specific angry people, or even people making stupid arguments in good faith. I want control over my own filter bubble. If that contracts my www to a gathering of friends and family, so be it.

If web 1.0 is simple content consumption, and web 2.0 is users providing content to each other filtered by powerful rent seekers, web 3.0 should be user governance. The "mod" system is an authoritarian lack of a governance process, and should be replaced with tools that aid collective decisionmaking.

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by cbsmith on Saturday November 06, 2021 @01:13PM (#29131953)
A hierarchy with the user on top is pretty much exactly what he's describing. It's a perfect environment for grifters & manipulators; to the extent that they get filtered out by people smart enough to recognize them for who they are, that's doing them a favour.
Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by api on Tuesday November 09, 2021 @12:16PM (#29164396)
This is a huge problem on conventional social media too.

We seem to be moving toward a society where grifters simply feast on the uneducated and un-discerning. The thing that makes it hard to police this is that the marks will themselves fight for the grifter, as we see with all the people fighting tooth and nail against their own access to health care or against treatments to stop them from getting horribly ill or dying in a pandemic.

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by evandwight on Saturday November 06, 2021 @12:26AM (#29127520)
What tools do you think would work?

I've been writing a Reddit clone that uses elected moderators, statistical sampling, and referendums to estimate the result of referendums. I'm curious what tools you think would work well.

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by s3tz on Saturday November 06, 2021 @03:22AM (#29128139)
Full transparency of how the system classifies a given person, person is fully annonymous and it's based on reputation alone. Then let ME decide the parameters of what I want to see. Treat it like a decision support system for content. Can be gamed for sure, but give new accounts the base defaults only (like certain subreddits do) and it would eliminate most of this since the barrier to abusing it is very high. Also, teach users that they might sometimes see something weird or bad, be transparent with them. This shielding behavior is like a helicopter parent soccer mom "protecting" their kid. It's annoying there and it's dangerous here.
Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by khimaros on Saturday November 06, 2021 @02:11AM (#29127925)
it sounds like Secure Scuttlebutt
Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by tikwidd on Saturday November 06, 2021 @03:03AM (#29128086)
A big downside with the Scuttlebutt system from a user perspective is that once I post something, it's out there forever. The best I can do is ask my friends to delete their copy of my post.
Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by bullen on Saturday November 06, 2021 @06:40AM (#29129097)
Can you link to it?
Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by evandwight on Saturday November 06, 2021 @10:58AM (#29130742)
It's not done yet. There's a discord link if you want to chat about how to improve it.

https://efficientdemocracy.com

New name needed

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by bullen on Saturday November 06, 2021 @01:26PM (#29132062)
I also made a reddit clone, but on top of my own HTTP server and database: http://talk.binarytask.com

Democracy only works when you have more energy available than people and that is about to not be the case after 200 years of extracting sunshine from the earths crust. The only thing we're efficient at is to waste energy!

Also "sign in with google"?

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by evandwight on Saturday November 06, 2021 @02:13PM (#29132454)
> http://talk.binarytask.com

Your own http server/database!?! Do you mean you implemented them from scratch? I'm just using nginx/expressjs & postgres. Edit: rupy! interesting! Does ssl kill it's efficiency?

> Democracy only works ...

Energy limitations seem beyond my lifetime. I just want to see how to run a community based on the will of it's members. Efficiently using their time.

> sign in with google

It's not ideal. I originally implemented my own authentication, however implementing it "securely" is a huge task. My main problem is unknown unknowns. Even big companies have non-perfect authentication, like leaking emails during recovery/login. If the site gets any traction I'll expand the authorisation options.

What do you think I could do to improve the site?

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by bullen on Saturday November 06, 2021 @04:27PM (#29133538)
HTTPS is garbage, but you can put a HAProxy with SSL in front of it if you want to waste energy... :D

I made my own secure user handling using this: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc2289

Re:The promise and paradox of decentralization by stevenroose on Monday November 08, 2021 @06:25AM (#29148221)
Please be aware of Lemmy, the ActivityPub-compatible Reddit clone. It's in a quite far stadium of functionality, but I'm sure extra development on their moderation systems would be more than welcome!