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Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by dekhn on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @05:41PM (#28531759)
no, public health isn't a personal choice: public health exists to apply population wide, standardized (possibly tailored somewhat) principles and actions and their loss function is to minimize overall suffering.

Personal choice goes against that, because many people's personal choices will be selfish or convenient to them while putting other people in harm's way. Within a large society, we must be cognizant of the likely impact of our decisions, but history shows that most people will not do so, and therefore must be compelled, legally, to take actions which are for the best of society.

Some freedom is defined and assigned at the federal, not personal level, with the goal of ensuring the national survives existential challenges (of which COVID may be one).

Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by betwixthewires on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @06:02PM (#28532053)
> Some freedom is defined and assigned at the federal, not personal level...

That's one philosophy of governance. I believe it to be fundamentally incorrect. But that's your philosophy and your view on this topic stems from that. I get your point, I just disagree wholeheartedly.

I have a right to be selfish. I owe no obligation to anyone else that I have not voluntarily entered into. If you want to redefine "putting other people in harms way" to include breathing the air around me without getting a medical procedure you can, but it is wrong IMO.

Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by dekhn on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @06:10PM (#28532162)
This isn't just a philosophy of governance, it's how nearly every country in this world works. You clearly have limits on the freedoms you claim. For example, if you live in the US and you're male, you're subject to the draft and the government will put you in jail otherwise. There are no universal human rights to be selfish (or any others, either).
Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by betwixthewires on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @06:19PM (#28532252)
> You clearly have limits on the freedoms you claim

We aren't talking about how things are, we are talking about how things should be, specifically, whether there should be vaccine mandates or not. Other existing violations of rights are wrong also.

So it is fundamentally about philosophy of governance. You believe society should come first, individuals can be compelled to benefit society even potentially at great cost to themselves, and that a person is morally wrong for not wanting to go along with that. I believe that it is morally wrong to expect a person to value anyone over themselves that they have not chosen to, or to be compelled to do anything on behalf of someone else.

Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by davorak on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @11:50PM (#28535049)
Do you agree that you liberty to swing your fist ends at a non-consenting nose though right?
Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by betwixthewires on Wednesday September 15, 2021 @02:20PM (#28542485)
Of course.
Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by dekhn on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @06:28PM (#28532360)
Ah, thanks for clarifying. I have nothing further to say to you.
Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by betwixthewires on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @11:07PM (#28534784)
Then why did you even reply?
Re:Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US? by mioasndo on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @08:02PM (#28533265)
So, your argument is that personal choice can be ignored in favour of your personal definition of 'public health'? Take your logic a step further - why can't we just completely ignore your personal opinion of what's a public good or what is 'public health'? Another step further - ignore everyone's opinion of what's public good and have a small group of elites define this for us? Your argument is nothing more than blanket support for literally any top-down policy which labels itself 'for the public good'. Yawn.