News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by cblconfederate on Monday September 13, 2021 @02:14AM (#28508313)
How is highlighting that he hasnt fiished his Phd an ad-hominem in that context? He s attacking the methodological flaws in the first sentence and his media portrayal as expert in the second. This should not be off-limits. (Their flaws are extensively discussed in the paper btw)

He also attacked Theranos for their media portrayal and secrecy long before anyone else did. Was that an ad hominem too? https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/21109...

> Of course that aside his predictions throughout the pandemic have been consistently terrible and undersold the threat, so I'm honestly not sure why we're still listening to the man.

Now you 're making an ad-hominem too (just like the tweet you linked)

> dealing with an unknown threat, saved countless of lives.

You really can't say that. Years later, with hindsight we ll be able to assess how many lives were lost because of the rampant policy errors all around. The pandemic was in no way optimally handled

Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by phreeza on Monday September 13, 2021 @02:36AM (#28508446)
> How is highlighting that he hasnt fiished his Phd an ad-hominem in that context

Isn't discussing the author's credentials pretty much the definition of an ad hominem? It goes against the person and not the argument the person has made.

Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by cblconfederate on Monday September 13, 2021 @02:47AM (#28508504)
like i said the arguments are discussed extensively in multiple places in that paper. in this case he uses their lack of credentials to explain why they made such errors. it would be a fallacy if attacking them was all he did (and shows why twitter and decontextualized snippets are bad for any kind of in-depth arguments)
Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by watwut on Monday September 13, 2021 @09:37AM (#28511302)
> in this case he uses their lack of credentials to explain why they made such errors

There is nothing extraordinary or wrong about people publishing articles while they "hasn't finished their Phd". Having published articles is practically required prior getting Phd. As such, it cant possibly explain anything. What Loanides is doing there is manipulating people who dont know how science works, how Phd is obtained nor know and how publishing works into thinking there is something lesser about author.

In the context of "scientific norms" this is egregiously bad behavior on Loanides side.

Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by cblconfederate on Monday September 13, 2021 @01:03PM (#28513866)
except he doesn't because the excerpt does not exist in the final published article. and he doesnt use twitter
Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by phreeza on Monday September 13, 2021 @03:56AM (#28508912)
Having an ad hominem alongside a different argument doesn't mean it's not an ad hominem in my book. Why not point out the errors without the additional ad hominem "explanation"?
Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by cblconfederate on Monday September 13, 2021 @05:41AM (#28509404)
You could -- but that's no reason to dismiss the whole paper. The linked tweet is using the ad hominem accusation to lie: the paper did address the flaws in their analysis - in fact he explains in detail why he thinks they were biased.

If you read the final paper (linked by bergstorm) it doesn't contain any of the excerpts that he screen-shotted. They probably existed in an early preprint of the paper, but they don't exist in the final paper! : https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/eci.13554

Re:How the pandemic is changing the norms of science by phreeza on Tuesday September 14, 2021 @02:04AM (#28520849)
Nowhere did I say the entire paper should be dismissed. Having an ad hominem is a smell though.