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Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by OldHand2018 on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @01:31AM (#28453403)
> I cannot imagine how they don’t see the SEC’s reasoning about Lend wrt Howey. If you want to argue that Howey does not apply or fight the decision/lawsuit, then fine. But feigning ignorance of something a (non-legal expert) programmer can connect the dots of instantly just makes me feel like they’re playing a PR game.

Grewal was a federal (magistrate) judge in SF before he quit to go work at Facebook. Everyone I know that has appeared before him has thought that he was very good. I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt - his entire legal career has been patents. Perhaps he truly doesn't see how this applies. But you are right, this just seems... off.

EDIT - I've read this a few times, and despite where it says that this is not an investment or note, it sure sounds similar to the unsecured demand notes that some car companies use for their captive finance operations (in day-to-day operations, they are virtually indistinguishable from an interest-bearing checking account). And those are most definitely SEC-registered securities.

See:

https://www.rightnotes.com

https://www.wsj.com/articles/car-maker-notes-attract-investo...

https://www.ford.com/finance/investor-center/ford-interest-a...

Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by staticman2 on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @02:43AM (#28453856)
You misunderstand the legal field if you think a lawyer should be given the benefit of the doubt when arguing on behlf of a client. Their job is to use the most persuasive propaganda they can get away with.
Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by darawk on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @04:19AM (#28454494)
In this context, his job is to assess the legality of it before they create the product. Companies don't generally want to invest in building something they aren't legally allowed to market.
Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by dragonwriter on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @05:46AM (#28454995)
> In this context, his job is to assess the legality of it before they create the product.

No, in this cass (that is, the case of the article under discussion) his job is to act as a PR representative of the company in the course of action it has chosen which is leading to imminent legal conflict with the SEC.

It’s true that he also had the job you discuss, but this article isn't the output of that job; that would be found in confidential internal advisory memos to the board and other executives.

Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by koolba on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @05:52AM (#28455019)
You’re mixing up what would be asked to the in house lawyers.

It’s not a binary: Is this legal?

It’s: Can we get away with this?

Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by gitfan86 on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @08:50AM (#28456247)
Sometimes people assume that lawyers write contracts with the goal of the contract never being breached. But plenty of times they write contracts with the goal of breaching it being of little significance for their client.
Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by TomSwirly on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @05:52AM (#28455020)
For a counterexample, look at Uber, Lyft, or AirBNB, whose whole business models have consisted of flouting the law and quickly adjusting when caught.
Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by dataflow on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @01:34AM (#28453422)
> his entire legal career has been patents

I'm confused, is patent experience particularly relevant to this case about securities law?

Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by OldHand2018 on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @01:55AM (#28453553)
No, that's why I'd like to assume that when he says he doesn't know why the SEC has a problem with their plan, he is telling the truth and this isn't just a PR attempt.
Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by josefx on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @02:51AM (#28453916)
Except he says they got a wells notice, first hit for that on google:

> A "Wells Notice" is a letter sent by a securities regulator to a prospective respondent, notifying him of the substance of charges that the regulator intends to bring against the respondent, and affording the respondent with the opportunity to submit a written statement to the ultimate decision maker.

So did they receive a notice with the charges or didn't they?

Re:The SEC has told us it wants to sue us over Lend. We don’... by throwaway2037 on Wednesday September 08, 2021 @03:10AM (#28454042)
Good question. I needed to remind myself of the nuance. First sentence from Wiki says: <<A Wells notice is a letter that the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) sends to people or firms when it is planning to bring an enforcement action against them.>>

To me: "planning" is the key term.

Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wells_notice

The Wiki article is short and dense. I highly recommend it!