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Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by epistasis on Sunday July 11, 2021 @01:32AM (#27798665)
There are even higher benefits by reducing the transmission and distribution requirements. T&D is hugely expensive, and local installs of solar reduces costs for the neighbors of whomever get solar installed.

Industrial installs are encouraged by utilities because they increase dependence on expensive, centralized, infrastructure. And for regulated utilities, this sort of infrastructure expense is easy to rate-base and increase profits.

But independent modelers that have been looking at fine-grained grid modeling, like Christopher Clack, have found huge cost savings by deploying massive amounts of storage and solar at residential and C&I locations first in the coming years, before doing larger industrial scar installations.

Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by Ekaros on Sunday July 11, 2021 @06:15AM (#27799708)
Will it reduce T&D? You still need some capacity for times when solar is not available. And cost doesn't really come from use, but infra existing. Just like Internet, after you have hardware and lines the use is somewhat marginal.

Ofc, local storage is an option, but will it be cheaper and safer than what we currently have? 20-30+ year old battery installations left to operate and just hang there don't look too promising to me...

Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by epistasis on Sunday July 11, 2021 @09:43AM (#27800724)
T&D must be sized for the peak of usage, meaning that most of the capacity sits idle, except for the extreme situations. If that peak is reduced, T&D upgrades and expansions are delayed as our energy demand grows, and all the equipment is used more efficiently. (And just as transmission has been neglected in the US for a long time, so has distribution, and we are going to need a ton of upgrades as energy demand grows while we electrify our energy usage.)

In nearly every market, energy use peaks at mid-day, just as solar is peaking. So distributed solar is a peak-shaving system, whereas centralized utility solar still requires the same big peak.

Distributed storage reduces both troughs and peaks, and makes T&D even more efficient.

Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by aledalgrande on Sunday July 11, 2021 @02:18AM (#27798807)
Yep 5% of electricity just wasted on resistance [1]. Also all the dangerous/expensive components of an electrical grid could be reduced, if energy was more decentralized. Don't think we're any close to that though.

PS: it's also a harder system to attack for malicious operators.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electric_power_transmission#Lo...

Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by MaxBarraclough on Sunday July 11, 2021 @04:11AM (#27799209)
> local installs of solar reduces costs for the neighbors of whomever get solar installed

How's that?

Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by 01100011 on Sunday July 11, 2021 @02:47PM (#27803552)
So you're suggesting that commercial users use less electricity in during peak illuminance than residential? I don't buy that. If you want to place the solar where the electricity is being consumed between 10am - 2pm you're going to put it on a commercial rooftop.
Re:Solar is dirt-cheap and about to get even more powerful by epistasis on Sunday July 11, 2021 @03:10PM (#27803762)
Commercial rooftop, residential rooftop, doesn't matter much at the geographic scale of grids. Certainly doesn't hurt to put it on commercial roofs though! And since those are often flat, it's probably a lot safer. Check out the map of electrical infrastructure in California:

https://cecgis-caenergy.opendata.arcgis.com/apps/california-...

You'll see that on the scale of substations, industry is right next to residential, and virtually indistinguishable.

Consider 500MW placed on the roofs of homes in San Jose, versus 500MW in a somewhat close green field build. The distant green field build is going to send every single kWh over transmission lines. Where as close to 0 kWh of the residential solar would hit transmission, meaning that all transmission requirements are lessened, as are distribution requirements.