News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by warent on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:16AM (#27311670)
Is there a way to read the full article? It's particularly interesting because Ive been considering moving from LA to somewhere else, perhaps Flordia.

Slightly off topic but while you're at it I'm curious if you have some advice. I'm a single guy in his mid 20s but dont really like the crazy party lifestyle or workaholic startup culture. Pretty downtempo, looking for a medium/large town or small city where I can have a sense of community and safety at night while still having decent restaurant, art, music options, thick forests nearby would be great too. Ideally somewhere that values charities / philanthropic work. Any suggestions?

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by pabs3 on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:20AM (#27311995)
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by widforss on Friday May 28, 2021 @05:15AM (#27313259)
How did you do that? Is that some magic URL parameter?
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by pabs3 on Friday May 28, 2021 @11:06AM (#27316265)
Yes, just append ?mod=djemalertNEWS to WSL article URLs bypasses the WSJ paywall.

There are also various WebExtensions to auto-bypass paywalls, I expect this trick is known by them.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by sfeng on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:24AM (#27311710)
I wouldn’t personally choose Florida. I would think Austin, Portland, Denver, Tuscon, Asheville first. Many college towns across the country could give you the things you’re looking for, a big question is what weather you want.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by Bud on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:44AM (#27311813)
An even better question: what place will continue to have the weather you want after climate change ruins the weather in wide swaths of the US in the next 5-10 years? I would not bet on Austin and Tucson, personally.

Therefore, we moved from the Bay Area to Minneapolis.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by unexpected on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:50AM (#27311843)
While I agree that climate change may have an impact on Tucson in Austin at some point, if your time horizon is the next 5-10 years, I think you'd be okay with either city.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by Bud on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:57AM (#27311872)
Keep in mind that weather impacts include impact to water resources, and those resources are already becoming highly threatened in much of the west and southwest. That's only going to get worse, and will do so more rapidly than the overall climate impact.

Also, as we've seen in the Bay Area, even the early stages of climate change can have sudden and severe impacts. That's why much of California is now on fire 3-4 months out of the year. Those kinds of impacts will start driving people out of more cities quite soon, and the fear that comes with that will kill property values. I would not want to buy a house in such an area if I could avoid it.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by rsj_hn on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:12AM (#27311944)
California is a fire hazard because of anti-logging policies. Once they get rid of 90% of their forests, they will be fine.

If they don't, nature will find a way to get rid of those forests one way or another. It's an arid state that underwent a 300 year drought from the 1600s to the 1900s. There was a brief wet period that looks like it's come to an end, and a lot of trees need to go.

Unfortuntately blaming climate change isn't going to help resolve this, and the state seems insistent that the correct solution is getting rid of plastic straws and ICE vehicles even as they are surrounded by over a hundred million dead trees that need to be culled, and the situation is only going to get worse.

So I'd say it might be a better approach to stay away from states that blame all their environmental problems on climate change rather than their own policies.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by wahern on Friday May 28, 2021 @02:06AM (#27312223)
> California is a fire hazard because of anti-logging policies.

What anti-logging policies? The Federal government owns 57% of the forests. State and local governments own a mere 4%. 39% is in private hands. Of that 39%, 60% (~23% of the total) is owned by timber companies. The remainder (~15% of the total) is held by small landowners. Source: https://lhc.ca.gov/sites/lhc.ca.gov/files/Reports/242/Report...

The Federal government can do whatever it wants. The state has no land to log. And most of the private land is owned by... logging companies, who are definitely not anti-logging.

As with so many things in this state, the problem seems to come down to California's peculiar environmental review laws, which make it easy for outside interests to challenge and delay private projects, including, apparently, forest management projects. See https://www.redding.com/story/news/2019/01/30/california-cal..., which discusses plans to allow aggregation of review approval--not because reviews are costly, per se, but because each nominally independent review multiples the disruptive power of third-party challengers; and https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2019-12-31/californ... reporting on the enactment of those plans.

California really just needs to overhaul its environmental review laws; specifically, by removing or at least substantially diminishing the power to independently challenge reviews and review approval through protracted litigation. But that's politically difficult because it's what empowers NIMBYs and activist organizations of all stripes and across the political spectrum. Everybody hates NIMBYs up until the point they're asked to relinquish powers that would allow them (or their favorite organization) to block stuff they don't like. Note that for most challenges concern about the natural environment is just a pretense, which is why when it comes down to real support for reform you can't find any votes, either in the legislature or through referendums. Republicans in Orange County abuse the review process just as much as tree-huggers in Marin County. Any kind of reform is easily spun into a narrative about removing local control--relinquishment of a veto power each and every Californian possesses over the land management practices of every other Californian.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by rsj_hn on Friday May 28, 2021 @02:26AM (#27312333)
Yes, Federal environmemntal laws also don't serve California or other arid jurisdictions well. I often feel like much of our policies are written by people who think the rest of America is New England and don't understand the needs of arid climates. Just look at how little we care about preserving aquifers versus preserving forests to see the bias.

But in CA you risk being sued even if you have a timber harvest plan on Federal land, and then you need to deal with california district courts. Do you think the Ohlone, when they burned millions of acres each year, cared about whether there was a red-legged frog in one of the areas they were burning? But when you need to drag botanists everywhere to check on each tree and measure the girth of the tree and note all the species around it, it becomes hard to do what you need to do, which is get rid of hundreds of millions of trees every single year to keep these pests in check.

Then there is the issue of local government, which while it doesn't control a lot of land, certainly controls a lot of land around cities, which is relevant for safeguarding lives and property. Take a look at what it takes to cut down a tree in Marin county - god help you if the tree is near a stream or if it is on a lot someone owns

https://www.marincounty.org/-/media/files/departments/cd/pla...

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by wahern on Friday May 28, 2021 @03:15AM (#27312580)
I live in San Francisco and am well aware of the insane amount of red tape and stiff penalties. I learned that the hard way after having to pay $3,000 in penalties and fees for removing a small tree the Friends of the Urban Forest helpfully planted directly atop my water line before we bought the property. (I was misinformed by a contractor about my ability to do so without first obtaining a permit.)

But these things aren't responsible for the systemic problems in this state. They're just what people are familiar with, and what drive the familiar refrains in communities across the world.

Zoning powers do contribute to systemic issues, but that's a different matter and varies locally. When zoning powers matter, it's when the local policies permit easy challenges. In both cases--zoning and CEQA--the fundamental problem is abrogation of Due Process--the orderly and equitable application of the law. Whenever a government makes a decision they're supposed to do so according to the commands of the law (including whatever specific statutes and regulations were promulgated beforehand), and do so in a strictly prescribed manner. Even if the fees are insane and the process slow, it's basically a fixed cost like any other. If the costs of a project pencil out, you proceed; if not, you move on. If too many people move on, it's relatively clear to policy makers and the electorate which hurdles (e.g. anti-logging laws) likely need adjusting. In theory the transparency and predictability make for a self-correcting system.

But when random citizens can interject themselves into the legal process, introducing arbitrary delays and costs, that's an entirely different matter. It creates tremendous uncertainty, much like if you had a capricious king making every decision. Time is money. Even if you know with absolute certainty the final verdict, if you don't know when you'll get that verdict you have no idea what your real costs are. Maybe you can placate the challengers w/ this or that concession or exaction. Either way, going in and until you get a court's final imprimatur, your risk is open ended. So not only do your direct costs increase, indirect costs like financing increase, and in general the uncertainty disrupts capital allocation, whether you're a homeowner or a billion dollar business. Every potential project, no matter how vanilla, turns into a high-risk, speculative venture.

Regulatory litigation over land use and development projects is the biggest problem facing California, IMO. The impact of everything else is relatively small. Other jurisdictions have the luxury of debating substantive policy. California's basic pathology is on a higher dimension altogether--a regression in the basic operation of orderly society; a government of men, not of laws.

You can see how this plays out w/ companies like Uber. Uber operates in a market not subject to this pathology. And despite their market being otherwise riddled w/ the same degree of red tape and costs, they do just fine. Whether they obey the law or break the law, they know their costs. (Indeed, often breaking the law is the cheaper option.) They could make more revenue w/ fewer regulations, and if the regulatory burden were drastically increased they might need to quit (like they said they would if they couldn't operate their drivers as contractors), but they enjoy an intrinsically business-friendly environment relative to markets dependent on land use and development.

FWIW, here's an example of some anonymous person(s), operating through an unincorporated association, using CEQA to prevent controlled burns in Mill Valley: https://www.marinij.com/2019/12/07/dick-spotswood-lawsuit-to...

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by petre on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:32AM (#27312056)
I always wondered about those dead forests in the US. Like why aren't they pruned or cleared up or and used for making cardboard or something useful rather than looking like a bleak wasteland? But the ones I saw were in Oregon which gets a decent amount of rainfall from what I know? Even more puzzling.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by rsj_hn on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:48AM (#27312130)
Trees can die because of diseases in addition to droughts. But in California the main culprit is drought(1), and those droughts are not going to stop. It's an arid climate, prone to droughts, so if you don't cut the trees down during wet years, they will burn down during the dry years. So many decades of limiting clear cutting and controlled burns, combined with an unusually wet 20th Century, has turned the state into a tinderbox. It's estimated that the state would need to remove forests equal to the size of Maine to get back to a tinder load comparable to what it had prior to the arrival of settlers, when native americans routinely burned millions of acres each year in order to reduce the forest sizes. History will not look kindly on those who romanticized California's forests.

(1) https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/why-californias-dr...

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by throwkeep on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:11AM (#27311937)
In part that, but also:

Decades of mismanagement led to choked forests — now it's time to clear them out, fire experts say.

“Forest management is a lot like gardening. You have to keep the forest open and thin," said Mike Rogers, a former Angeles National Forest supervisor.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/decades-mismanagement-l...

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by raverbashing on Friday May 28, 2021 @03:57AM (#27312807)
Are you aware of how summers in Minneapolis are right?
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by today20201014 on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:32PM (#27317447)
In my experience summer in Minneapolis is fine.

Comparing it to where I have lived I think for heat and humidity, it is milder than central Texas / comparable to Rhode Island

Just comparing heat, it is milder than summer in the Central Valley/SoCal. SoCal heatwaves are oppressive.

Air quality in Minneapolis goes down when there are fires in the West, but it is obviously worse for us folks in the West.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by irrational on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:53AM (#27311854)
Seriously. I wouldn’t buy a house south of the 45th parallel anymore.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by Bud on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:59AM (#27311887)
Funny you should mention that; Minneapolis happens to be the largest city in North America that is located directly on the 45th parallel.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ohazi on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:59AM (#27311883)
I just drove through Phoenix and Tucson. Arizona is a big hot pile of rocks, and humans really have no business living there.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by isoskeles on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:17AM (#27311975)
Flagstaff is not at all like this though. I've only driven through, but it's quite beautiful and has much more of a forest than the rest of Arizona. I don't know if it checks the other boxes this person is looking for.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by foxyv on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:22AM (#27311699)
I've heard that the Denver CO area is pretty hot right now. Most of the stuff you mention is pretty good there. However I also saw an article about some of the less ethical companies not hiring people there because of salary disclosure regulations. Property values are nuts, but not California nuts... yet.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by testesttest on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:35AM (#27311767)
Just left Denver. The job market is weak for software developers. The housing is not as expensive as California but the pay vs housing costs is probably worse. Remote gig is better than what is available locally. Expect some hostility if your moving in from CA.

I will miss the sking and mountains though....

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by nickthemagicman on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:20AM (#27311994)
Where'd you go if you don't mind me asking
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by haram_masala on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:14AM (#27311960)
You're not going to believe me, but if not, it's your loss: Richmond, Virginia. It absolutely ticks all of those boxes, and does so with an offbeat gusto.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by peterburkimsher on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:28AM (#27311729)
Would you consider other countries? I found all those in Kaohsiung, as well as great electronics markets.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by thequux on Friday May 28, 2021 @05:35AM (#27313345)
Likewise, there are a lot of nice cities in Belgium that offer various balances of those requirements. I settled on Ghent, but Brussels has more nightlife and local forests at the cost of being dirtier and somewhat uglier. You might also like Liege, which is close to some excellent hiking and thermal baths.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by warent on Friday May 28, 2021 @03:00AM (#27312502)
I've been seriously considering Taiwan! Sadly the current instability in its relationship with PRC makes me fear going there if war breaks out.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by SmellTheGlove on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:30AM (#27312047)
Portland, Maine. Great city, I miss Maine every day.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by forgotmypw17 on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:25AM (#27311719)
What I would do is buy a minivan and go looking around the country. . .
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by axaxs on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:17AM (#27311977)
From Florida. It isn't perfect, it works for me. I wouldn't recommend it for you. AMA, I guess.

But my honest assessment is that everyone wants the same thing. Give me a cheaper house, in a picturesque neighborhood that is all friends...walkable to shopping, and maybe the beach. And no crime. As my realtor put it sarcastically... 'oh you want a little farm in a safe area in downtown Miami...no problem!'

Doesn't exist bud, for any amount of money. Choose a few things you -really- value, and hyperfocus on that.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by OldHand2018 on Friday May 28, 2021 @10:31AM (#27315754)
I looked at Florida earlier this year and decided against it. The “no income tax” thing gives people the wrong idea - it’s not a cheap place to live unless housing is cheap, which is no longer the case. Property tax is similar to the situation in California. The house is reassessed when sold and then you have small increases until you sell. Newcomers bear the brunt of it and long-time residents pay very little. And then homeowners insurance anywhere close to the ocean!!!
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by axaxs on Friday May 28, 2021 @11:20AM (#27316440)
Absolutely. Housing wasn't ever 'midwest cheap', but cheap compared to coastal cities. That was generally offset by highish property taxes and insane house insurance rates. As an example, I remember looking up a house in Vero Beach selling for $720k, which I thought was a bit insane for the area. I found it last sold for $280k in 2012. That kind of growth is untenable for any area, and it has no signs of slowing.

Moreso than that, I would only really recommend most parts of Florida to introverts. The people are generally unpleasant and cold compared to anywhere else in the whole Southeast. I think it's a state full of transplants, and well, people with a big family or friend network are less likely to up and leave their home. So we get the loners and the hated, so to speak.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by teebs on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:14AM (#27311957)
As someone who grew up there I'm a little biased but I think Portland, OR fits your needs almost exactly. It's a city people move to for the lifestyle - interesting culture, good food, beautiful nature nearby (including plenty of forests) with very reasonable work/life balance. In fact, that's exactly why my parents moved there from San Francisco in the 80's (although at the time the culture and food wasn't nearly as good as it is today)
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by kilbuz on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:47AM (#27311825)
Twin Cities in MN (Minneapolis and St. Paul).

If you can handle or even enjoy the winters, it's about as perfect a place as you can choose.

Madison, WI also for something a bit smaller, but similar vibes.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by Bud on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:01AM (#27311893)
That's what we just chose. We figure that climate change will probably make the winters at least slightly less severe. :) We hope. Perhaps that's just a dream.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by danhak on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:54AM (#27311860)
Seconded, this is one of the loveliest parts of the country if you can tolerate the winter. Twin Cities and Madison are both incredibly pleasant, livable with lots to offer and surrounded by some beautiful forests and nature. Madison is a bit smaller and more of a college town.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by cozzyd on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:17AM (#27311976)
If you're not scared of cold weather, some reasonable options might include Burlington, Madison, Duluth, Champaign, and Grand Rapids.

If you want something warmer, maybe Charlottesville or Knoxville?

If you don't mind insufferable heat then Gainesville is reasonable.

I may have miscalibrated what you mean by "small cities." For even smaller places, I'd choose some random upper midwest non-flagship college town (Winona? LaCrosse? Houghton? Valparaiso?).

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by N1H1L on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:18AM (#27311983)
Shhhh!!

No Knoxville. Have you looked at housing inflation recently?

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ramraj07 on Friday May 28, 2021 @02:03AM (#27312199)
Don’t worry Tennessee name keeps people away sufficiently by itself
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by chmod600 on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:23AM (#27312006)
Portland could be a good fit. But you say you are single and I don't think it's a great place for dating (maybe just my experience).
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ericcholis on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:34AM (#27311762)
A bit out of left field, but what about Buffalo, NY?
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by N1H1L on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:18AM (#27311980)
Why not Chattanooga, TN? Great municipal broadband, beautiful hills nearby and amazing forests all around. It has a very laidback vibe too.

I like the vibe in Rayleigh, NC too. Great tech scene, yet not as expensive as Austin/Boston. Smokies are 2 hours to the west, while the Outer Banks are two hours to the east.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ngngngng on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:20AM (#27311992)
Salt lake would work. And Utahs a great place for a variety of lifestyles, especially involving the outdoors.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by jborichevskiy on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:20PM (#27317299)
I was very pleasantly surprised staying in Oceanside, CA. Small town, amazing surfing and ocean access, biking, very walkable for groceries/food/coffee/bars, felt safe at night, and close enough to San Diego/LA for the crazier stuff.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ramraj07 on Friday May 28, 2021 @02:01AM (#27312192)
Consider college station TX? Weather is still not ideal (occasional tornado and hail) but otherwise cheaper than Austin small enough not to have traffic but with all the basic needs you would have from a biggish city. Also Houston and Austin are both 2 hours away.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by HeyLaughingBoy on Friday May 28, 2021 @03:47PM (#27319678)
Minneapolis. You might not like it when it gets down to -20F, but it's easily the nicest city I've ever lived in and clicks all your checkboxes. The first year I lived there I kept kicking myself for not having moved 10 years earlier.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by hyperrail on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:23AM (#27311701)
Archive.today has it in full: https://archive.ph/vMbpD

I wonder how they're so consistently good at evading the Wall Street Journal's paywall, which is usually strict with no metered free limit and limited exceptions even for Twitter and Facebook shares. Probably the WSJ's website team would like to know too.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by rrrrrrrrrrrryan on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:31AM (#27311749)
Probably just clear cache and cookies, then spoof the referrer as Facebook. Works for almost all major paywalled news sites.

Edit: An even simpler solution:

https://github.com/iamadamdev/bypass-paywalls-chrome/blob/b5...

They might just run that extension actually, since it's popular and regularly updated.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by celim307 on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:31AM (#27311747)
Denver is all of that, Boulder maybe even more. But it’s expensive and I left
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by cupcake-unicorn on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:22AM (#27311698)
PNW
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by lioeters on Friday May 28, 2021 @04:23PM (#27320025)
I second this. I've lived off and on in Washington, Oregon, Northern California, and there are many medium to small towns that fit the description.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by myself248 on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:36AM (#27312071)
Allow me to throw in a vote for Royal Oak, Michigan. I think it checks all the boxes, especially still being habitable with ongoing climate change.
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by cozzyd on Friday May 28, 2021 @02:38AM (#27312387)
Royal Oak isn't really a small city though. I mean it is, but it's a Detroit suburb, so probably not what OP meant.

Michigan does have plenty of nice smaller cities though (e.g. Grand Rapids, Lansing, Ann Arbor, St. Joseph, Traverse City, Marquette, Houghton).

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by tsjq on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:25AM (#27312016)
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by ayyy on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:19AM (#27311990)
> Is there a way to read the full article?

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/bypass-paywal...

There's a version for Chrome also. On Android, I use that extension with Fennec from F-Droid.

Also I did SF->Florida and looked at a bunch of regions. St Petersburg sounds like the type of town you'd like.

Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by boc on Friday May 28, 2021 @01:03AM (#27311899)
Lawrence, KS or Fayetteville, AR
Re:Americans are on the move, but their stuff doesn’t always... by qshaman on Friday May 28, 2021 @12:54AM (#27311855)
Yes , I strongly recommend you Florida , central and north Florida have the best spots to live in. Sell your place in the west coast and move to Florida, is amazing. https://youtu.be/HeGbDRbodNQ