i not sure what your talking about... people get their phones fixed all the time, its just the companies make it very difficult or not possible at all when you can't get access to parts, or you have companies like Apple who prevent you importing parts even if the parts are ripped out of broken devices.

Then you have Apple who lie they say you can't recover your data or repair your device, yet you go to a repair shop and you get your data back and phone fixed...

But that’s my point. Why do buy a phone from company like that? Just stop buying from them and buy from another manufacturer instead and the problem will be solved.

okay true, but you think its fine for Apple to prevent you from taking out say your broken camera and replace it with a working one? or a LCD... or any part? You think its fine for say John Deer to prevent you from repairing your own tractor? if any part is replaces with exactly the same part but your tractor won't turn on because the "encryption link" is not correct?

would you be fine with your car preventing you from changing your tire? unless you get them to do it and only install their "tires"?

You're not making a convincing argument when the person you're arguing with is coming from the "free market" angle.

Someone arguing in favor of allowing market forces to solve the problem truly do think it's fine for Apple and John Deere to do those things. The solution for lack of repairability isn't to enact legislation to force them to make their products more repairable, it's to stop buying Apple and John Deere.

To a point, they're right, but relying on market solutions assumes rational consumers, which we have anything but. I think back about 7 years when I bought a Motorola Droid Turbo. Back then, consumers were asking for phones with longer-lasting batteries and screens that wouldn't shatter because you sneezed. This phone was exactly what consumers were asking for, with it's monstrous 3950 mAh battery, and a screen that could survive a 100-foot drop onto pavement (Saw a video of it!), but most people had never even heard of it, and still bought their iPhones and Samsung Galaxy phones which couldn't even survive a waist-high drop onto the sidewalk without cracking the screen.

Consumers are not rational, and so the market will never be rational, and relying on market solutions does not always work.

Sorry, I’m not sure if I follow. Consumers are not rational, ok fair. But should we then listen to their demands to have things their way? Like devices, which can be repaired? Seems like a rational want? I don’t get it

Recognize that on HN, you're in an echo chamber.

Yes, we on HN are far more likely to demand repairabiliy, but most consumers don't care about the ability to repair their devices. Or at the very least, don't care so much that they'll choose not to buy the latest phone because the battery is not easily replaced.

And it boils down to what are consumers actually buying? If consumers are demanding something and the corporations are not providing it, but they buy the products anyways, the corporation has no incentive to provide it.

There was a lot of uproar when Apple removed the headphone jack when they made the iPhone 7, but that didn't stop consumers from making it the best selling smartphone in the world at the time, with ~40 million units sold. And now guess what? Other phone manufacturers followed suit. I guess headphone jacks aren't that important after all.

The market can demand whatever the hell it wants, but rarely follows through.