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Re:Stock Market Returns Are Anything but Average by dcow on Friday April 30, 2021 @12:02PM (#26995201)
The problem is options/derivatives trading. That is straight up gambling. There’s a meta market where you bet on the behavior of the market...
Re:Stock Market Returns Are Anything but Average by kqr on Friday April 30, 2021 @01:49PM (#26996829)
While that is a large part of it, it also seems like an unfair simplification, for two reasons:

1. You can construct portfolios of derivatives that are almost equivalent to holding the underlying except at a smaller initial cost. This gives you nothing but flexibility in ownership.

2. Remember that fire insurance is also straight up gambling that your house will burn down. Gambling counter to your interests is what we call insurance, and the proper mix of underlying and derivative is a hedged, lower risk portfolio than just the underlying.

Re:Stock Market Returns Are Anything but Average by hattmall on Friday April 30, 2021 @02:13PM (#26997167)
It is ALL gambling, options are just another instrument, they can make your gamble more risky or less risky depending on how you use them.

Except in very rare cases stocks are entirely based on what investors think someone else is willing to pay in the future.

Re:Stock Market Returns Are Anything but Average by dcow on Saturday May 01, 2021 @05:19PM (#27009944)
When I buy TSLA stock I’m not gambling on the future of Tesla. I’m investing in electric vehicles. So it’s “value investing” insofar as that’s my motive for investing. Sure I could gamble with plain stocks in the market, but thats not my motive or goal. Others, sure.

Of course stocks are based on what investors think they’re worth. Thats the whole point. It’s not gambling. Tesla is worth a lot of money because people think it is. If you’re susceptible to fomo hype trains and looking for a quick buck, you’re looking at the market as a slot machine, no doubt.

Stocks pay owners other than their value in the market, too. Capitalists look to make money off the market. It doesn't mean it’s all gambling. That’s a little reductive.

Re:Stock Market Returns Are Anything but Average by Der_Einzige on Friday April 30, 2021 @03:08PM (#26997886)
When gambling, the house "always wins" over time. With options trading, that's not always the case. Anyone with a gambling addiction would be far better off doing options trading - their chances are much better.