You'll find normal room lights obnoxiously bright and wonder what the hell we're thinking if you try exclusively candles or very, very dim handheld lights/lanterns after sundown for a while (think, medium-bright night lights at the very brightest, and even that's kinda too bright) and entirely avoid glowing screens. Might find the insomnia or night-owl tendencies that're "just how you are" disappear in a hurry, too. Go figure, if it's not actually dark and there's an incredible amount of flashy entertainment on tap it's really hard to sleep like you're supposed to. Wonder why we have problems with that, as a society. Guess we'll need a whole cottage industry of books & magazine articles to mis-explain it.

I've gone weeks with no lights. IMO between the screen backlights and occasional use of a flashlight they're not only unnecessary, they're obnoxious.

Lightbulbs and refrigerators don't contain electronics. I mean, modern LED lightbulbs contain some primitive electronics, but basic refrigerators do not.

By "electronics", the GP means consumer electronic devices like computers, televisions, and smartphones.

> Lightbulbs and refrigerators don't contain electronics.

> By "electronics", the GP means consumer electronic devices like computers,

Have you looked at refrigerators lately? "Smart" ones are very common and even the cheapest ones basically all use electronics to control the temperature and the cooling cycle. Nothing sophisticated, yes, but if LEDs count, these definitely do, as well.

That's why I said basic refrigerators, which still have compressors controlled by an analogue thermostat. Like the kind you find in a typical cheap rental apartment. Refrigerators are one of those appliances that really do not benefit much from "smart" technology. And LEDs don't count; that's my point.

Fair enough. When LEDs don't count, though, I think it's kinda hard to draw a line - do radios count? Clocks? Amplifiers? Vacuum tube amplifiers?

But I agree with your general point.