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Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by nemo44x on Saturday February 06, 2021 @04:29PM (#26050111)
Have you considered why we do this? How would our society be different if only well-to-do people could eat meat regularly? Would a regular guy be content with wealthy people eating steaks while jet-setting around the globe because of climate change?

I think a populist uprising would occur almost immediately and we’d see heads on pikes with their decapitated mouths stuffed with cabbage for all to see. It would be super easy for a party to take advantage of this and they would.

In short, it would be a miserable time.

Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by danShumway on Saturday February 06, 2021 @04:50PM (#26050309)
> That's not necessarily bad, but if we're going to be messing with the market anyway we could choose to subsidize other things.

I'm saying we shouldn't pretend that meat is as cheap as it is on its own. We should acknowledge what the reality is: meat is cheap because as a society, we choose to use tax dollars to make it cheap.

We could do the exact same thing with plant-based meat. We could shift some of those subsidies so that meat and plant protein were equally subsidized. We could balance them out. We can talk about the logistics.

But I think sometimes the conversation gets stuck entirely on "how could we make artificial meat cheaper" when the reality is that animal meat is expensive, and the big difference between animal meat and plant meat is that we pretend that animal meat costs less than a free market would otherwise dictate. Of course I want to artificial meat to be cheaper, but I'm also not going to pretend that it's a fair fight.

The reason why this matters is because I do see arguments from people that say that it's just too expensive to have a social shift towards vegetarianism, and it can't possibly scale, and it's government interference to try and prop up plant-based foods. And yeah, we can have a values conversation about whether society wants us to make meat cheap. But most of the rest of those objections are crap. There are a lot of people that do think that meat is actually priced realistically based on what it costs to produce. They don't realize that it's just that our government chooses to make very specific farming outputs cheaper.

Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by nemo44x on Saturday February 06, 2021 @05:18PM (#26050536)
I just think it’s politically a non-starter. They tried to tax sugary drinks in the most liberal city in America and heads exploded.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by Qwertious on Sunday February 07, 2021 @02:02AM (#26053253)
>I just think it’s politically a non-starter.

That's a separate issue to whether we should value a free market. Or is it? If we're only going to support a "free market" in spots where it's politically convenient, but be enthusiastic about stripping any regulations that are politically viable, then what we'll see is a systemic stripping of regulations that protect people without power, without touching regulations of people with power.

This ends in disaster.

Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by markdown on Saturday February 06, 2021 @04:54PM (#26050336)
This is nonsense. People elsewhere in the world pay 50% to 100% more than what Americans pay for beef.

Removing some subsidies and making beef slightly more expensive would save money and people would just eat beef one day less/week.

Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by Aerroon on Saturday February 06, 2021 @06:11PM (#26051008)
And they'll replace their meat with what? More sugar? Bread? Sugary bread? I think you underestimate how big of a deal food is to people. I believe that any change will be towards food that's even worse for people.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by dnhz on Saturday February 06, 2021 @07:43PM (#26051571)
Hopefully with less food in this theoretical scenario because most people are overweight.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by xorcist on Sunday February 07, 2021 @08:36AM (#26054922)
For many people, those calories doesn't need to be replaced with anything.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by jamil7 on Sunday February 07, 2021 @01:58AM (#26053237)
Why would people replace meat with sugar?
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by thejynxed on Sunday February 07, 2021 @07:46AM (#26054652)
Because of how much of it is added into every alternative meat replacement product, and it's a shockingly high amount if you read the labels on some "organic" and "plant-based" products.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by jamil7 on Sunday February 07, 2021 @09:39AM (#26055307)
I have a few issues with this. As far as I know health concerns related to meat replacements aren't to do with sugar levels, probably more likely with saturated fat and sodium (which exists in regular meat too). Also I don't know why you bothered to put organic in there as well since the we're talking about meat replacement. Finally I think you're making the assumption that if we don't eat meat we need meat replacements at all.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by bigfudge on Saturday February 06, 2021 @04:56PM (#26050355)
If meat is the trigger to generate real social change then great! I don’t want to see heads on spikes, but if people are genuinely bought off by cheap meat that’s kind of sad.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by nemo44x on Sunday February 07, 2021 @10:38AM (#26055698)
I’m not sure it’s the type of social change you’re anticipating.

I think the fact everyone has access to the food they want and is part of their culture is a major reason we generally have a peaceful and free society.

I can only imagine the resent from the middle and lower classes when “the elites” eat steaks on airplanes and they, the plebs they are, are forced to subside on processed alternatives while being forced to become a proselyte to a cause that those that can afford to ignore do.

Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by adrianN on Sunday February 07, 2021 @01:00AM (#26053017)
The average US citizen eats around 100kg of meat per year. You could easily cut that in half and still eat meat every day.
Re:How to lower the price of plant-based meat by zionic on Saturday February 06, 2021 @04:50PM (#26050312)
The rich: steak is only for us now, for the climate and stuff

The poor: Time to eat the rich