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Re:U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests by tempestn on Wednesday January 06, 2021 @10:20PM (#25666878)
I'd argue that the problem with this analogy is that a bird flying overhead is something we know is possible and indeed common. According to all scientific knowledge and evidence, resurrection is not possible. So absent significant evidence, it's not logical to believe that this happened. We also know that religion has historically provided numerous benefits to societies, allowing for trust, cooperation, and trade in societies that predate effective government. So it is logical to assume that such belief systems would develop, and that societies that developed them would prevail over those that didn't, even in the absence of supernatural evidence.

Given that religion contradicts what we know about the physical world, and that its existence is explained without reliance on the supernatural, it's not logical to believe its supernatural claims.

Re:U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests by camhart on Wednesday January 06, 2021 @11:08PM (#25667179)
So if something cannot be observed by you, within your 15-100 years of life (assuming you fit within that range), that simply means it's impossible for it to have occurred? And that any claims otherwise are misinformation?

No one claims that someone is resurrected every day. The claims of Christianity are that it occurred once, and that it was a miracle.

The thought that it's impossible for something to have occurred unless it's commonly overserved isn't sound. There is no such requirement. There are plenty of rare events that occur, with and without scientific explanation.

Update: Perhaps here's what we're missing. There is information, misinformation, and then there's claims that cannot be proven or disproved. I do not believe that all things are false until proven true. I believe that Christianity, and many other religions, can be neither proven or disproven using modern science. It is neither misinformation or information. It is a belief.

Re:U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests by arcticbull on Thursday January 07, 2021 @02:52AM (#25668426)
> I do not believe that all things are false until proven true. I believe that Christianity, and many other religions, can be neither proven or disproven using modern science. It is neither misinformation or information. It is a belief.

Where we disagree is that you think that a 2000 year old text that's been translated 7 or 8 times and by what we would consider today to be idiots (human IQ has increased dramatically over time, in 1910 alone the IQ midpoint would be today's 70, which is a full standard deviation lower) - should be given the benefit of the doubt and be granted a reverse burden of proof. Idiots mind you who would have you burned at the stake for the laptop you're replying on.

The scriptures should be approached analytically with modern techniques. Does anything in there line up with observable reality? No. Is there a plausible explanation? No. Ergo, we should assume its false unless we discover some evidence that it might be true.

The challenge with doing that is religions rely on indoctrinating the youth before they're capable of making rational evaluations and play to our evolutionary weaknesses (the need for an explanation).

> There are plenty of rare events that occur, with and without scientific explanation.

Indeed but I'm not going to recommend telling a 4 year old I've just dunked under water about them based on a book written by an idiot 2000 years ago.

> It is neither misinformation or information. It is a belief.

It's a myth. Myths are fine, but shouldn't be presented as fact. And they certainly shouldn't be true until proven false.

By this token, until you prove otherwise, the whole world was started on a giant turtle. [1]

[1] https://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.ca/en/article/turtle-isl....

Re:U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests by animal_spirits on Thursday January 07, 2021 @10:14AM (#25671954)
I think calling ancient people idiots is ingenuine. Just because you know trigonometry and someone 2000 years ago didn't know trigonometry doesn't mean that person is an idiot...

I agree there are many strangeties that are in the Bible that don't seem to be plausible, and we should not accept them as fact, due to the nature of translating ancient texts and the corrupting influences of government and religions. You are right that certain stories shouldn't just be believed or accepted without evidence. But you are wrong to say that there is nothing in the scriptures that lines up with observable reality.

The Bible contains many many stories about Human behavior and emotions. Mob violence, rape, drunkeness, greed, corruption, and contain many good lessons on understanding these behaviors in order to overcome them. These are behaviors we observe in our everyday lives.

There are great teachings in the Bible if that is what you are looking for. If you look in the Bible to try and find every falsehood or inconsistency you will never actual find anything of value to your life.

"It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter." - Proverbs 25:2

Re:U.S. Capitol Locked Down Amid Escalating Protests by arcticbull on Thursday January 07, 2021 @10:45AM (#25672283)
> I think calling ancient people idiots is ingenuine. Just because you know trigonometry and someone 2000 years ago didn't know trigonometry doesn't mean that person is an idiot...

Nothing to do with trig, it's based on IQ assessments. [1] Human intelligence has increased dramatically as a function of nutrition, as a function of living in cities, as a function of education and so on. It's even happening to raccoons who live in cities. [2]

It's not their fault, but compared to modern humans, they were big dummies.

> There are great teachings in the Bible if that is what you are looking for. If you look in the Bible to try and find every falsehood or inconsistency you will never actual find anything of value to your life.

Yeah, it's a modern Aesop's Fables. It's a bunch of stories, some made up, some collected from experience, which are used to provide guidance to living your life.

[1] https://ourworldindata.org/intelligence

[2] https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200416-how-city-life-ca...