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Re:My Experience at Apple by PragmaticPulp on Friday January 01, 2021 @03:26PM (#25606659)
I can empathize with your story. I once landed what I thought would be my dream job at my dream company. I quickly discovered that the position was open because all of the previous team had quit due to the extreme toxicity.

> The primary lesson I learnt is that it doesn't matter if you work hard

Be careful about getting jaded and cynical. This is far from a universal truth in the tech industry. I've hired a few ex-FAANG who had burned out and become cynical on work altogether. We had to let them go because their negativity was dragging everyone down.

A similar thing can happen to people who go through difficult divorces. If they let themselves become cynical, they start believing that marriage is a doomed institution and that all members of their ex-spouse's gender are equally terrible people and such. It can become very counterproductive to moving on.

Re:My Experience at Apple by dvtrn on Friday January 01, 2021 @05:21PM (#25607824)
The last few jobs I’ve had were glowing from the interviews and believe me I asked some very tough questions I hoped would be revealing enough without torpedoing my candidacy.

Every one of them: as soon as I started, the foundational person of the team quit, you know the guy or gal who burned themselves out building the process. Fixing all the cruft and actually trying to unfuck everything but leaving scant documentation because the mountain of technical debt rivaled the heights of K2?

As a result I had to “drink from the water hose” constantly. And this is something I am absolutely sick of doing, and no team should tolerate it.

It’s happened so often I’m beginning to wonder a) how I can assess if the team is bleeding talent (I’ve had companies straight up lie about things like attrition and retention) or b) if I just have some kind of gravitational pull for companies that are running people out the door.

Re:My Experience at Apple by Grimm1 on Friday January 01, 2021 @07:00PM (#25608688)
a) how I can assess if the team is bleeding talent

Nothing wrong with asking the average tenure of people on the team imo, that is something you can frame in a way less likely to make them lie.

Re:My Experience at Apple by dvtrn on Friday January 01, 2021 @07:06PM (#25608732)
I'll be honest, my default perspective is to expect filibustering and non-answers from all but the actualized and self-aware teams, who if reading this thread and many, many others like it, and lived experience are anything reliable: are less common than their frustrating counterparts.
Re:My Experience at Apple by Grimm1 on Saturday January 02, 2021 @10:34AM (#25613452)
You can use that to make your decision then. Both filibustering or a non answer in this case are as good as a negative answer for what you want to figure out with it.
Re:My Experience at Apple by Balgair on Friday January 01, 2021 @09:36PM (#25609780)
>As a result I had to “drink from the water hose” constantly.

I've only ever heard that phrase as 'drinking from the fire hose', I didn't know that even a water/garden hose was considered too much.

I think I need to find a better ... career (?)

Re:My Experience at Apple by dvtrn on Friday January 01, 2021 @09:42PM (#25609816)
Ah, error on my part. Firehose is correct.