Re:Cryptocurrency company Ripple says SEC lawsuit is imminent
by garmaine on Tuesday December 22, 2020 @04:51AM
(#25504612)
Ripple (old-school Ripple, not XRP) doesn't need any clearing house or federation. It's just you, me, and the hops along the way interacting long enough to facilitate the transaction.
Re:Cryptocurrency company Ripple says SEC lawsuit is imminent
by hardwaresofton on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @12:21AM
(#25514634)
My point is that how is that not a hawala system, just facilitated by a distributed ledger instead of phone calls? If it is, why isn't illegal just like those other systems?
The similarity here I thought was the trading of IOUs -- this seems to be very similar to what hawala is/was.
Re:Cryptocurrency company Ripple says SEC lawsuit is imminent
by garmaine on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @12:42AM
(#25514750)
There is no middle man facilitating ripple. (Well, ideally. RipplePay was centralized. But it didn’t need to be.)
Also, hawala is legal in most jurisdictions I believe.
Re:Cryptocurrency company Ripple says SEC lawsuit is imminent
by hardwaresofton on Wednesday December 23, 2020 @01:57AM
(#25515170)
Thanks, I think this might be the big differentiator -- the existence of middlemen is probably the large difference here, but it feels like at some point you're definitely going to need someone to keep track of value across IOUs somehow and at the very least who is trust worthy.
Re:Cryptocurrency company Ripple says SEC lawsuit is imminent
by garmaine on Friday December 25, 2020 @03:46AM
(#25535177)
Well to be accurate there are middlemen in most ripple transactions, but not a middleman of the traditional sense. They're not pure facilitators, but rather active participants in the transaction. I'm not a lawyer, but I understand that by some interpretations this makes a difference in the regulation.
So the thing is, isn't this kind of system (very similar to a concept I can only remember as Hawala[0]) explicitly illegal?
> Hawala or hewala (Arabic: حِوالة ḥawāla, meaning transfer or sometimes trust), also known as havaleh in Persian,[1] and xawala or xawilaad[2] in Somali, is a popular and informal value transfer system based not on the movement of cash, or on telegraph or computer network wire transfers between banks, but instead on the performance and honour of a huge network of money brokers (known as hawaladars). While hawaladars are spread throughout the world, they are primarily located in the Middle East, North Africa, the Horn of Africa, and the Indian subcontinent, operating outside of, or parallel to, traditional banking, financial channels, and remittance systems. Hawala follows Islamic traditions but its use is not limited to Muslims.[3]
> Some government officials[which?] assert that hawala can be used to facilitate money laundering, avoid taxation, and move wealth anonymously.[citation needed] As a result, it is illegal in some U.S. states, India, Pakistan,[14] and some other countries.[citation needed]
The whole IOU system doesn't need crypto to work -- but you just can't set up the kind of clearing house/federation that you'd need in the US because it's illegal, I thought.
[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawala