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Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by slg on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @03:35PM (#25434898)
Would you say people aren't software developers unless they are employed by a company to predominately develop software? Because your comment certainly reads like that type of gatekeeping regarding who is and is not a journalist.
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by karaterobot on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @04:13PM (#25435325)
The fact that arrests of journalists are being tracked implies that some gatekeeping about who is a journalist is necessary. The clearer the definition is, the more meaningful the statistics will be. That is the only way we would actually be able track whether journalists are being targeted by police.
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by AnthonyMouse on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @04:48PM (#25435640)
> The fact that arrests of journalists are being tracked implies that some gatekeeping about who is a journalist is necessary.

Not really. Just track the statistics for full-time journalists. Then you don't have to engage in gatekeeping of journalism, you're just sensibly excluding full-time bounty hunters who wrote a news article that one time from the statistics on arrests of full-time journalists, even if the bounty hunter was, in that one instance, a journalist.

Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by slg on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @04:25PM (#25435466)
There is a difference between defining a category of people and gatekeeping a category of people.
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by pc86 on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @06:09PM (#25436637)
What's the difference?
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by slg on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @06:48PM (#25437051)
The dictionary definitions of the two might be similar, but there is a big difference in connotation and modern usage.

I would say the focus is on opposite sides of the spectrum. When you are defining a group, the primary focus is on who should be included. The focus of gatekeeping is on the people who should be excluded. This is usually done in order to raise the status of those who are included or those who are setting the rules for inclusion. Those rules are often arbitrary or draconian and are usually set by some central authority (or someone who feels they have such authority). This authority will then be the one who doles out permission for others to participate.

That is where the software developer example comes in. Anyone can join the open source software development community and they will only be judged on the merit of their contribution. They might have never contributed to any OSS. They might have never been paid to develop software. They might have no formal education in software development. None of that would matter if we are defining people based on the merit of their work. However they would likely be excluded in a system that relies on gatekeeping.

Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by esyir on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @09:27PM (#25438297)
A definition of journalists that excludes small scale bloggers, and such would create a different population from say, one that comprised "anyone who self identifies as a journalist", for instance.
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by mosdave on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @03:49PM (#25435058)
> Would you say people aren't software developers unless they are employed by a company to predominately develop software?

Yes, without question. It's tautological.

Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by throwaway894345 on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @03:56PM (#25435142)
It would perhaps be tautological if the OP had qualified professional software developers, but the tautological definition for "software developer" is "anyone who develops software (irrespective of whether they do it professionally)". If we're going to pick nits, we may as well be accurate, right?
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by slg on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @04:13PM (#25435337)
Which was exactly my point. They are limiting the title of "journalist" to exclusively people who have been anointed as journalists by some gatekeeping entity. This rules out hobbyist, freelancers, self employed people, people just breaking into the industry, and all sorts of other people. The software developing equivalents of those people are inarguably part of the software development community. Why wouldn't their counterparts in another industry be considered journalists?
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by 80386 on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @09:09PM (#25438171)
If you don't rule out hobbyists, freelancers, and the self-employed, I can declare myself a journalist, start a blog or a Twitter, and start throwing Molotov cocktails, and if I get arrested for it, that's another arrest of a journalist.

And as a Molotov-cocktail-throwing opponent of the regime, I want to raise the number of arrests of journalists, because that makes the regime look bad, as shown by this thread. Even if every single arrest is of someone like me - a left-radical with a Twitter account, not Walter Cronkite or whoever - it's unlikely that anyone will bother to check, and even more unlikely that, if anyone bothers to check, very many other people will hear about it.

Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by slg on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @11:06PM (#25438927)
Where is this trope of Molotov throwing journalists coming from? I have seen it multiple times in this thread and it is just bizarre. No one would consider someone throwing a Molotov a journalist, no one would count such an arrest as the arrest of a journalist, and no one would consider the arrest an attack on press freedom.
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by 867-5309 on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @03:56PM (#25435141)
what about unemployed/retired software developers, and open source contributors?
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by tick_tock_tick on Tuesday December 15, 2020 @04:43PM (#25435609)
Doesn't the fact that you had to use different language to communicate their status lead into their point?
Re:Record Breaking Number of Journalists Arrested in the U.S... by 867-5309 on Wednesday December 16, 2020 @02:53PM (#25447645)
no, it questions it