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Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @04:45PM (#25365657)
I think the accidental straw-man is actually your reply. People give Facebook their access willingly and they know what information they input into Facebook.

Should Facebook have all the info your bank has for instance? Or auto mechanic, your realtor? This is a slippery slope of logic of shared data for all leads to.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by arilotter on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @05:11PM (#25365978)
> People give Facebook their access willingly and they know what information they input into Facebook. I don't think this is true. Facebook tracks your activity all over the web on thousands of third-party sites and builds a unique profile to identify you, without regard for you having an account. You can't opt out of this if you don't have a Facebook account.

Some of these "social graph" features will do things like link two people as friend suggestions if they both have your phone number in their contacts book, even if you haven't consented to Facebook building up some information about you.

This doesn't sound like willing access & knowledge of what information you provide to Facebook.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by not2b on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:05PM (#25366648)
If you haven't consented to share your contacts with Facebook, but two people have consented who have you as a phone contact, then you're a link. This can be "interesting" when one of the parties has a duty to maintain privacy, like a psychiastrist. See this article: https://splinternews.com/facebook-recommended-that-this-psyc...
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by Talanes on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @10:49PM (#25369442)
This explains a lot of the weirder suggestions I got in college. People I had done a group project with, but never communicated with outside of in-person, would show up as suggestions all the time. I'm sure in each of those cases there was one person in the group who everyone was in phone contact with.
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by rapnie on Thursday December 10, 2020 @03:56AM (#25371412)
Indeed. Also people do not sufficiently realize how much more can be deducted about the nature of a social relationship other than a mere "Person A knows Person B", if you combine it with the PII you have of both users (and even more if you consider the network in its entirety).
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:02PM (#25366586)
I guess that’s what separates me and you I have more faith in humanity. I think all this false outrage about data being sold on systems that are free to use will die down and people overtime understand that the Internet doesn’t run on pixie dust and fairy magic.

PS by fighting this point you’re merely pointing out that giving more businesses this data isn’t a good idea

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by pmoriarty on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @09:46PM (#25369019)
"I think all this false outrage about data being sold on systems that are free to use will die down and people overtime understand that the Internet doesn’t run on pixie dust and fairy magic"

It doesn't have to run on companies spying on their users either.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Saturday December 12, 2020 @12:25PM (#25399855)
Companies spying on people has existed since the beginning of business. You call it spying we call it market research.

Sam Walton of Walmart would record everything about his competitors legally and illegally as well as clients yet you never see that in the news, why? Because it’s not sexy, it’s not about the internet.

This is why Equifax which was a much more horrible data breach isn’t thought about, yet everyone gets their panties in a bunch about Facebook

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by prewett on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @09:07PM (#25368692)
I willingly gave Facebook information about me, although at the time I had no idea what they were going to do with it. However, I did not willingly give FB my phone number (they asked my friends to give that to them via the contact list in their phone). I did not willing give FB personalized training data for recognizing my face; FB weaponized my friends into doing that.
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by njarboe on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @05:18PM (#25366062)
I'm sure Facebook buys all the data on you that it can, which in America is an amazing amount of information. Your auto mechanic is likely already selling what is being done to your car to CarFax, etc.
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @05:59PM (#25366552)
Ok so what about the bank then? Hell equifax had a horrible social security outbreak yet somehow idiots are still mad at Facebook vs the government
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by Noumenon72 on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:54PM (#25367326)
Can a consumer buy this data? I suspect I'm getting too many bushings and brake rotors but haven't kept track.
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by terryf on Thursday December 10, 2020 @01:18AM (#25370421)
This is an excellent idea! Someone should create a company that buys all the data that is available about people, structures and correlates it and then sells it back to the people

The ironic beauty in that would be awesome. Also, I'd kind of like to get it about myself for similar reasons :)

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by alisonkisk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @08:07PM (#25368129)
Usually they only sell to businesses. For "privacy".
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by zepto on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @05:31PM (#25366226)
People willingly gave Facebook their social graph thinking it let them share photos and messages with their friends.

They had no real idea what else it would or is being used for.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by Lio on Thursday December 10, 2020 @05:26AM (#25372085)
Not everyone has willingly given their social graph to Facebook.

Facebook builds shadow profiles on non-users and then fills them out with, amongst other things, data it gets from their actual users that they didn't no they were sharing.

This is particularly sneaky when Facebook has used dark patterns to trick app users into granting them permissions they don't strictly need for service.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:09PM (#25366702)
Putting your data publicly online can be not only used by Facebook but all your friends too, hell sometimes profile images end up on google, so just because they had no real idea it shouldn’t be facebooks fault if your friends decide to print screen your photo and redistribute it. That data you put out publicly is public once it’s in public domain the public will use it
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by alisonkisk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @08:08PM (#25368144)
Disney seems to have a different idea of "public domain" from you. Why don't I have the copyright to my life, if Disney has the copyright to Iron Man?
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by Vespasian on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @10:30PM (#25369309)
Of course you do (GP is wrong) at least for media which you create that clears the threshold for copyright.

The difference is that Disney grants license to its content after (potentially drawn out) negotiations and payments, while the typical Facebook users "Agrees and accepts to grant Facebook a worldwide license"

BTW it doesn't confer a license (mostly) to anybody else but normal users do not sue.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by rolph on Thursday December 10, 2020 @04:31PM (#25379000)
collect every piece of data about yourself you can think of, copyright the publication, issue DMCA taketowns on your intellectual property
Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @06:06PM (#25366652)
I don’t know about you but whenever I take a picture and share it with friends I trust that the company who’s picture I just gave two he’s going to make the best use of it on their platform.

They have to monetize and I approve.

Hell I’m willing to bet if Facebook puts into their agreement that every photo you upload to their platform is partially owned by them then people will still upload photos.

It’s not the data that we find valuable, it’s the connections they make or will make, and to this company. Next time you take a photo and find it’s shared with not just Facebook but a whole slew of other companies you tell me if that’s the right thing to do.

The person above said “do you trust all Facebook employees” well you can make that blanket argument for every company in existence and giving more companies our data isn’t a good solution

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by zepto on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @07:18PM (#25367614)
By ‘used for’, I don’t mean that people might display the photo somewhere you didn’t want.

I mean Facebook might perform facial recognition on your photos and infer connections to other people you didn’t explicitly tell them about.

I mean that facebook might track your location and app launches and identify where you go on vacation and when you shop.

These are the kinds of thing nobody gave consent for.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by vladmk on Sunday December 13, 2020 @11:30PM (#25413571)
I mean this has and is already happening. Example a foster kid was suggested to be friends with his father, in some cases it’s great, two long lost siblings or parents/children’s reunited. In other cases people complain.

The consent thing can both be good and bad, just like the invention of the internet and electricity before that. I’m trying to make that point that giving away your data is gonna be a commodity once everyone realizes they’re not a special snowflake

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by dannyincolor on Thursday December 10, 2020 @03:01AM (#25371068)
Well, the issue is that they do have that sort of data. Massive firms exist to commingle all variety of data with FB’s social graph.

Check out LiveRamp for example; they literally scan in physical documents like car mechanic paperwork (seriously) and dropship them into S3 buckets to huge data brokers every day.

Take that and merge it with facebook’s social graph, how many ms you look at a photo on Instagram and how long you take to reply to someone on WeChat, and you have an awful lot to work with.

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by 8note on Thursday December 10, 2020 @01:02PM (#25376434)
People willingly give permission for Facebook to share their data, too.

What difference does that make? Facebook almost certainly knows my banking information, without me giving it directly to them

Re:FTC Sues Facebook for Illegal Monopolization by bigyikes on Wednesday December 09, 2020 @07:07PM (#25367484)
Could there be some kind of granular permissions (with privacy-first defaults) to mitigate this problem?