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Re:The Die Is Cast: Hardware Security Is Not Assured by salawat on Friday November 06, 2020 @01:24PM (#25009880)
Technically, from tge end user perspective, several of these attscks already occured through injection of industry specified "secure computing" IC's into consumer grade jardware. Your GPC hides data from you not because you asked for it, but because trade groups decided they couldn't pass up on monetizing you, yet they needed to strongarm silicon manufacturers to enable adversarial integrations intended to firmly lock you out of the overall state space of your computer.

Call me an extremist if you want, but few manufactured goods have seen the level of anti-end user engineering effort put into them than computers. And that's a sad thing to see.

Re:The Die Is Cast: Hardware Security Is Not Assured by tenebrisalietum on Friday November 06, 2020 @03:21PM (#25010765)
Intellectual property laws are what creates this discontinuity - your CPU runs licensed code that you don't own so it makes sense to develop technologies to enable stuff you don't own to live in the CPU but deny you access to it.

There's a lot of overextensions of the concept of IP that of course make sense to lawyers, judges, and people who have high net worth derived from leveraging this artifice, but the whole thing probably should be reformed at some point if anyone cares about things other than extending the concept of ownership to ideas.

For example, I'm still not clear how I can simultaneously own a media product, like a VCR tape or CD, and not have a "license" from the studio (a non-governmental entity) to publicly exhibit it.

Re:The Die Is Cast: Hardware Security Is Not Assured by tsimionescu on Friday November 06, 2020 @08:27PM (#25012598)
I get the general idea that it's not normal for us not to have full access to the products we own, and I absolutely support it in spirit, and I believe it is an important right that we will have to fight for, lest we end up with more and more totalitarian control of our lives.

But I don't really see how you can compare this to an attack, unless you actually prove some measurable harm today. What exactly are they doing with your computer that harms you in any direct way?

I absolutely agree on your last point though. It is quite a tragedy when we think about the amount of human intelligence and hard work that has been thrown away on protecting systems from their own owners.

Re:The Die Is Cast: Hardware Security Is Not Assured by lixtra on Friday November 06, 2020 @10:22PM (#25013011)
> What exactly are they doing with your computer that harms you in any direct way.

Remember the Sony root kit[1]?

So we agree that the measures were harmful in the past. Of course you wouldn’t ask if we were widely aware of current issues. I think we also agree that a lot of interesting things can be hidden from the user if you have access to the keys to the secured enclaves (or if you manage to break in). If this was ever exploited, we may know in a few years or never.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG_copy_protection_roo...

Re:The Die Is Cast: Hardware Security Is Not Assured by a1369209993 on Friday November 06, 2020 @10:25PM (#25013021)
What is someone who plants a recording camera in your bathroom doing that harms you in any direct way?