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Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by The_Colonel on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @04:58AM (#24552379)
> No, a lot of java critics complain about it being hard to tell what's calling what at the framework-to-user-code boundary

That's rather an industry criticism since these problems exist everywhere and are often direct consequence of trade off for looser coupling.

There are also often alternatives - e.g. Dagger for DI and MapStruct for mapping which go the code generation path which allow you to statically inspect the whole code path, you can also always trade the looser coupling for more directed paths e.g. for logging by avoiding the wrapper and using a logging library directly.

Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by valenterry on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @12:39PM (#24556652)
> That's rather an industry criticism since these problems exist everywhere and are often direct consequence of trade off for looser coupling.

No they don't. Java is just not expressive enough, so library/framework authors have to decide between bloat or magic and they often choose magic for better or worse. There are languages that doing better in this regards.

Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by apta on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @09:58PM (#24562173)
> There are languages that doing better in this regards.

Such as?

Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by valenterry on Tuesday September 22, 2020 @10:49PM (#24562443)
As we are talking about Java, the closest language would be Scala. The language is much more flexible and powerful. This brings different problems onto the table, but it resolves the issue with awkward framework annotation/wiring problems that I have experienced in Java way to often.
Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by apta on Wednesday September 23, 2020 @03:55PM (#24571206)
What about languages not on the JVM platform?
Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by valenterry on Wednesday September 23, 2020 @09:02PM (#24574236)
Yes there are also such languages which are not on the JVM platform!
Re:A Picture of Java in 2020 by apta on Friday September 25, 2020 @04:36PM (#24593844)
I'm curious what they are in your view.