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Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by mixmastamyk on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:17PM (#24122857)
It is generally not reasonable for traveling domestically. Imagine having to show ID to take the bus/metro. Sounds absurd? Well, think of the children.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:19PM (#24122884)
The rationale is that the potential damage is higher with a flight. Bombing a bus/metro might a dozen or so people. Bombing a plane can easily kill hundreds.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by mixmastamyk on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:23PM (#24122934)
Metro bombs have done incredible damage. And as mentioned elsewhere, it is trivial to manufacture id and so is not a solution. But, conveniently it sure does fill govt databases.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by gruez on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:20PM (#24122889)
And how does requiring ID mitigate that danger?
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:22PM (#24122910)
People who are security risks can't board.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by Nasrudith on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @03:01PM (#24124429)
That is complete bullshit. They not only don't need to board but if they pulled a gun the TSAs would be an unwitting accomplice in letting them reinact "No Russian" with their bullshit security theater gathering hundreds into a massive shooting gallery with no cover. Really that is why there was such outrage over the level - it illustrated vividly how the TSA failed on the most basic logical level.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by dudul on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @04:40PM (#24125708)
This actually came up after the 2015 attacks in France. Most crowded locations became heavily protected, bags were all checked, etc. The result: a massive crowd in front of theaters, concert and sport venues, etc. Israeli consultants basically summed it up by saying that these procedures were creating massively vulnerable areas with potentially 100+ victims if a guy detonated a bomb in front of the venue.

I remember seeing a documentary showing how in Israeli airport one of the main goals was to always avoid long lines and big groups of people.

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by thih9 on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @03:58PM (#24125251)
> "No Russian"

Context: "a controversial level in the 2009 video game Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2. In the level, the player can participate in a mass shooting at a Russian airport.".

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Russian

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by geofft on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:32PM (#24123058)
That assumes you have a perfect list of who's a security risk and who's not, and the TSA is not Santa. The 9/11 hijackers boarded with their real names, and in practice there are plenty of easy ways around this, like radicalizing someone.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:35PM (#24123107)
Why does it have to be perfect? It could still be effective if it stops 50% of security risks.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by geofft on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:38PM (#24123171)
Because in a free society, a system that stops crimes half of the time and arbitrarily denies people their rights half the time is considered unjust.

Would it be okay for police to stop suspicious-looking people on the streets and ask them for ID and run background checks if it caught criminals 50% of the time?

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by mixmastamyk on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:49PM (#24123370)
There’s no proof it stops even 2%. Anyone with a week’s preparation could defeat it. Yet the innocent will be punished every day.

Remember the German pilot who crashed on purpose? Good thing they had ids on everyone.

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @03:22PM (#24124738)
Well, we know screening luggage is useless too, as the TSA doesn’t catch 10% during tests.

So we should just let anyone into a plane with no screening at all?

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by chillacy on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @08:18PM (#24138668)
I don't understand, if you actually assume that ID screening is actually 100% useless (in reality it probably has some reduction), you wouldn't screen at all yes.

If you disagree with the premise that ID screening is 100% useless, then dig up some evidence of its effectiveness.

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by compiler-guy on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @06:55PM (#24126937)
As long as they have no weapons, we should let anyone on a plane that has a ticket.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @07:23PM (#24127105)
How do you supposed we check for weapons? Seems like everything thinks current checks are "security theatre" and do absolutely nothing.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by compiler-guy on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @07:29PM (#24127142)
Showing your id does absolutely nothing to prevent weapons from getting on the plane. If you are so dangerous that your mere identity is enough to prevent you from getting on a plane, then you need to be arrested.

Identity is extremely easy to fake. If you are planning in such a way that you have a realistic chance of hijacking a plane, getting a fake ID good enough to fool the two-second check at the TSA checkpoint is the least of your problems.

There is some argument that a properly built luggage and human screening system could actually prevent weapons from making it on the plane. But ID doesn't really come into it.

But even if we can't develop a system that prevents weapons from getting on planes, it doesn't follow the id checks would be a suitable alternative.

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Wednesday August 12, 2020 @01:13AM (#24128784)
But even if we can't develop a system that prevents weapons from getting on planes, it doesn't follow the id checks would be a suitable alternative.

I never said it was.

Everyone tells me the TSA can't even stop bombs or guns from being brought on, so let's skip that.

ID doesn't help, so let's skip that.

So my question is - do we just let people board without any checks at all?

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by dudul on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:23PM (#24122930)
How many terrorists have been caught before boarding a plane because they didn't have an ID?
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:36PM (#24123126)
I have no idea.

But Israel, who is clearly a major target for airline bombings hasn't had one in what? 50 years?

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by mixmastamyk on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:41PM (#24123232)
That’s due to their extensive interviews. The id is not relied on as a magic safety card.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @02:06PM (#24123588)
You’re not getting on an Israeli flight without ID.

But yes, they interview heavily.

Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by mixmastamyk on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @03:15PM (#24124634)
I don't believe there are israeli domestic flights, but if there are they are insignificant.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by ehasbrouck on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @03:43PM (#24125064)
FWIW, during non-pandemic times there are scheduled airline flights from Tel Aviv (TLV) and Haifa (HFA) to Eilat (ETM).
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by techdragon on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:33PM (#24123088)
A large Crowded bus easily hold 72 people all of whom would likely die in a bomb attack on the bus. And that’s not counting anyone near by on the street.
Re:TSA considers new system for flyers without ID by refurb on Tuesday August 11, 2020 @01:38PM (#24123182)
Right, dozens, versus potentially 500+.