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Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by TulliusCicero on Thursday July 23, 2020 @05:59PM (#23932874)
It's generally easier to play the role of the Very Reasonable Person Who's Just Asking Questions when you're defending the status quo; any change you stymie by undercutting people's emotional energy or by slowing things down works to your advantage.
Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by woofie11 on Thursday July 23, 2020 @06:05PM (#23932972)
Not always. I've used the "Very Reasonable Person Who's Just Asking Questions" to ask some very, very uncomfortable questions.

Here's one you can try in the current political climate: "Why don't you have ANY [insert minority] employees working in your organization?"

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by skinkestek on Friday July 24, 2020 @08:29AM (#23938662)
To give an example of someone a large subset of HN would like to sh*t on with that question, a company I have worked for:

In our case (we have some minorities but not as many as HN would like).

Why: because they aren't available.

We have KPIs for HR and managers that strongly encourage it, but there just aren't more qualified women/black/etc coders.

Which, in our case, translates to less than 5 (but awesome, and highly regarded) black persons[0], about 30% women.

[0]: Note however that the demographic is quite different here in Norway. I know people here who never saw black people except on holiday until they were far beyond 20 years old. In their defense though: 1.) Part of why there are so few black peopøe here seems to be that keeping slaves hasn't been popular here for hundreds of years. 2.) Norwegians have accepted a lot of people from other countries over the years: Pakistani, Chilean etc, so I don't think it is about xenophobia.

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by woofie11 on Friday July 24, 2020 @04:01PM (#23943825)
Why do you believe [insert minority] coders aren't qualified?
Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by JAlexoid on Saturday July 25, 2020 @12:22AM (#23946814)
Long term poverty in certain areas; Leading to poorer education systems; Resulting in less than stellar academic attainment; Resulting is lack of experience.

If I put out a simple coding test and some people cannot crack it - I'm not going to check if my 2+2 test is unfairly biased towards people with red hair.

Did you know, for example, that even fairly wealthy black American families are less able to educate their kids to the same level as white American families? Because access to proper education and parental education levels matter a lot. Because kids growing up in poor areas will get lower levels of attainment. Because long term poverty matters.

Breaking that education barrier takes more than one generation.

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/280232788_Race_Pove...

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by skinkestek on Saturday July 25, 2020 @10:02AM (#23949230)
This question doesn't follow.

We are actively looking for them, employing them whenever possible[0].

[0]: I lost two female candidates I tried to hire, one because she wasn't fluent in a language that a majority of our customers use and one because HR didn't react in time and when she interviewed with us she was also on the way to her second interview at another company.

Both landed well-paying jobs shortly afterwards. I guess we are not the only company trying to look diverse.

There are so few black people around here that I guess the reason I don't see more black coders is just statistics.

[dead]
Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by woofie11 on Friday July 24, 2020 @08:47PM (#23945964)
I think you lost the thread of conversation somewhere. The original question was:

"It's generally easier to play the role of the Very Reasonable Person Who's Just Asking Questions when you're defending the status quo; any change you stymie by undercutting people's emotional energy or by slowing things down works to your advantage."

I gave a counterexample.

That said, in most cases, good equity policies have nothing to do with racist quotas, and everything to do with cultures which are accepting of diverse patterns of communication, cultures, and behavioral styles, and with identifying talent wherever it may be found, rather than using surface indicators like school someone went to, clothing, or similar.

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by zanny on Thursday July 23, 2020 @06:11PM (#23933069)
Its enlightened centrism and a place of profound privilege to be comfortable in the world as it exists thinking all of those "extremists" advocating for change are just being too emotional and partisan.

Centrism is de-facto the status quo. Which, in current times, means support for the police as it exists, supports for business regulation as it exists, supports greenhouse gases and military conduct as it exists, supports the behavior and election processes of politicians as they exist, etc.

Its simply the privilege of the majority to be the "moderate" ones. To be radical is not to be good or bad, it just to be outside the norm. And it makes sense that those in the norm find those outside it dangerous and threatening, because... they want to be. Thats the whole point. Their time is wasted if the goal is not to become the new moderate, the new normal, the new center.

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by Nasrudith on Sunday July 26, 2020 @02:03AM (#23954801)
You call them priveledged but are they necessarily always wrong? There would be a bias towards more extreme passions to try to go towards extreme changes and would feel a temptation towards partisanship feeling so outnumbered.

Given that norms say nothing about it doesn't mean they are always but the possibility exists that the extremists really are too emotional and partisan, and getting what they wanted would be the proverbial dog catching the car and not knowing what to do with it or crashing it immediately.

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by shirakawasuna on Thursday July 23, 2020 @06:16PM (#23933140)
In addition, this "centrism" isn't actually "center", ideologies don't actually fall neatly along a single dimension. These are just handy ways to reference and group ideologies.

The "center" people are referring to here is a United States-centric form of liberalism. It's not any less "extreme" than communism, it's just the dominant political force and, as you say, has the privilege of positioning itself as the comfortable default. In reality, it's a fairly extreme commitment to a different set of principles.

Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by natechols on Thursday July 23, 2020 @06:49PM (#23933594)
How is the US style of center-liberalism extreme, as compared to an ideology that demands total control over the economy and its citizens? Or do you think concepts such as "rule of law" are extremist?
Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by zanny on Friday July 24, 2020 @02:47AM (#23936511)
At the very least the commodification of absolutely everything is pretty extreme.
Re:62% of Americans Say They Have Political Views They’re Af... by Nasrudith on Sunday July 26, 2020 @02:15AM (#23954850)
It isn't absolutely everything for one. If it was then you could legally buy slaves, nuclear weapons or foreign nations could buy New York in its entirety based upon a market cap would be far closer to commodification of everything.

Commoditization is just a fundamental result of math basically. Fundamentally there is still a cost to a commodities no matter what party pays for it to provide it or bar access through certain methods as illegitimate like it being illegal to buy organs from a donor for transplant.