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Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by UncleMeat on Saturday May 09, 2020 @05:10PM (#23128347)
> A recurring pattern in this debate is that people criticize Damore for a lack of expertise. Which is odd given that Damore, a Harvard Masters Degree holder in Systems Biology, is clearly conversant with the research and the context he is giving advice in.

Oh boy. I've got a PhD in CS from one of the best programs in the world. I'm wildly unqualified to synthesize research in another field and would surely make terrible errors if I tried to connect the dots between citations, especially if I started with my connections and went looking for associated citations. Having a familiarity with research is absolutely not evidence that his conclusions will be strongly considered.

This discussion has been had a thousand times. People he cited have responded to his writing. There can be no productive discussion about "were his conclusions correct or not" at this point.

Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by ALittleLight on Saturday May 09, 2020 @06:37PM (#23128836)
Do you genuinely believe that you are unqualified to read research papers and come up with an opinion about them with sufficient rigor to merit responding to a request for a feedback from a training program you attended at work?
Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by UncleMeat on Sunday May 10, 2020 @12:53AM (#23130390)
Yes absolutely. I'm barely even qualified to synthesize conclusions from CS papers outside of my subfield. Drawing broader conclusions from a slice of the literature requires immense context.
Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by ALittleLight on Sunday May 10, 2020 @12:13PM (#23133718)
If you aren't able to read research papers and synthesize an opinion on them then by your own standards it seems you shouldn't have an opinion here. You can't tell whether Damore was right or wrong because you can't read papers from different fields and reach conclusions.

You think the authors Damore cited rejected him. Perhaps you have an example of that. I haven't seen anything beyond the authors agreeing with Damore's interpretation of the facts and saying they don't know about the conclusions. It's obviously not very compelling given that Damore was metaphorically tarred on feathered on social media and fired, so researchers saying they "don't know" about the conclusions might be because they genuinely don't know or might be because they don't want to invite backlash of their own.

Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by UncleMeat on Sunday May 10, 2020 @01:06PM (#23134179)
> If you aren't able to read research papers and synthesize an opinion on them then by your own standards it seems you shouldn't have an opinion here. You can't tell whether Damore was right or wrong because you can't read papers from different fields and reach conclusions.

I cannot personally derive a conclusion about Damore from the literature. What I can do is ask world experts about their thoughts. In general, this is an effective way of developing reasonable opinions about the state of research. I'm friends with a few social psych faculty who study workplaces and let's just say that they don't hold Damore in high regard.

I'm super uninterested in having an argument about the merits of his essay since that discussion has been had thousands of times and no progress can be made. But "well he has a master's degree from harvard" is among the least compelling arguments in his favor.

Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by ALittleLight on Sunday May 10, 2020 @02:25PM (#23134794)
Sure, his master's degree isn't the most compelling argument. It's somewhat more compelling an argument than "My unnamed expert friends don't hold Damore in high regard".

If world experts have weighed in on Damore, link to their opinions. I'm happy to discuss those.

Re:James Damore and three others end Google suit by UncleMeat on Sunday May 10, 2020 @06:29PM (#23136916)
Like I said, I'm uninterested in trying to convince other people about Damore. It isn't productive at this point. This is just how I personally came to my conclusions.