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Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by lmm on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @02:42AM (#22672557)
> The rational way to behave is to not live roll to roll, so to speak. A well stocked pantry won't have trouble in a scare because... well it will have stock.

Just-in-time manufacturing succeeded because supply chains became reliable enough that factories didn't need their own stockpiles. If you're out in the country and you have a big pantry then sure, stock up, but those of us living in the city may not have space. And even if you do have space, if everyone realises they have no stock and decides to buy up a month's supply, that has pretty much the same practical impact as hoarding.

Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @03:00AM (#22672666)
"Hoarding" is just a smear word on building an emergency buffer just-in-time. Or, JIT supply chains extend all the way to end-consumer, so let's not act surprised that a spike in demand due to perceived risk increase breaks everything up the chain. This should've been conpensated for in the chain.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by maccard on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @04:15AM (#22672990)
no, "hoarding" in this sense isn't a smear word on a buffer, it's buying 4/5/6x your normal buffer, to the point that people who haven't hoarded are now starting to be left without. I have a 48sqm apartment with 2 adults and a dog. we only _just_ have enough space for 3 weeks worth of all supplies. we're now running low on the things that people started panic buying a month ago, because of hoarding, not because of buffering.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @05:09AM (#22673206)
> I have a 48sqm apartment with 2 adults and a dog. we only _just_ have enough space for 3 weeks worth of all supplies

I have a 44sqm apartment with 2 adults, an infant and a cat, and we've managed to fit a month's worth of supplies in a single wardrobe. I don't think space is a problem (weight is, OTOH).

Suddenly stocking to up to 6 months of everything? That's hoarding. Building a month's worth? That's a minimum if you want to stay safe in case you and your family get quarantined, and your normal buffer should be around that anyway, regardless of the pandemic.

Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by realityking on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @06:15AM (#22673482)
If everyone who didn't have a stash before is suddenly stocking up for a months supply of everything, you get shortages. The right way to build up your supplies is slowly over time.

Indeed FEMA is now asking that folks only buy a weeks worth of groceries: https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/03/23/coronavirus-new-guide...

Over here in Germany the recommendation has always been to have supplies for 10-14 days at home. Seems like a more reasonable number than a months worth - especially for city dwellers.

Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @06:34AM (#22673580)
That's indeed the right solution. But it needs to be enforced by the stores - as many do now, with per-customer purchase limits.

> the recommendation has always been to have supplies for 10-14 days at home. Seems like a more reasonable number than a months worth - especially for city dwellers.

That's a nice recommendation for a calm time, but a bit short for the pandemic. If you get quarantined, you need to stay put for 14-21 days. Add a bit of padding to account for undersupplied stores (and to add a margin for error), and you arrive at 1 month's worth.

Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by glenneroo on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @08:05AM (#22674148)
We've seen this coming since at least early February. That's exactly when I started stocking up, buying ~2x amounts of non-perishables (e.g. 2 packages of pasta) instead of waiting for the impending hoarder shitstorm at the very last minute. I forget where I read this recommendation (WHO?), but it has definitely paid off, I haven't been to the store in almost 2 weeks :)
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by realityking on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @04:28PM (#22678630)
That assumes you have absolutely zero access to groceries for those 14-21 days. But there are still delivery services and neighbors. In Germany, city governments have actually delivered food to those quarantined.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @05:29PM (#22679222)
I'd say that's a safe assumption to make. On top of that, even contactless delivery by via service or neighbour has nonzero risk of communicating the disease (in either direction), so it's worth minimizing the need for it.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by Thlom on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @08:14AM (#22674195)
Interesting. Here in Norway the recommendation has been to keep supplies for 3 days, including water, power supplies (battery banks), a radio with full batteries, heating and cooking possibilities and so on.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by vekker on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @08:16AM (#22674212)
I agree with you. People have been hating so much on hoarders, while not acknowledging that the real problem is that people are way too reliant on a just-in-time supply chain. It's really not that difficult, expensive, or space-consuming to have a buffer of at least one month for scenarios like this. Yet, most people don't build up this buffer over time, out of laziness, and then they go around blaming others for the shortages during a crisis (or they go panic-hoarding themselves).
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by tomerv on Thursday March 26, 2020 @02:25AM (#22691097)
I used to go to work every weekday, and eat 2 meals there. Now I'm at home 24/7, so I'm already eating 5x the amount (before this, I would barely eat at home). Also, my girlfriend is here with me. I used to have a many months' worth of stock in the pantry, but now it turns out that it's just enough for two weeks.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by Cthulhu_ on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @06:12AM (#22673467)
Having a buffer is fine, but only starting to build up your buffer when everybody else does so as well is not. Everyone could've kept a month's supply of toilet paper on hand already. We've had an emergency supply of food and water (should last about a week?) for a couple of months now. I mean a few years ago we had months of drought, the tap never stopped but in some areas pressure was reduced, so it can happen to anyone.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @06:35AM (#22673591)
My complaint is that I see people screaming "hoardres" where what really happens is someone buying an extra day's or two worth of supplies, and/or are buying for themselves and the extended family. Maybe things have changed now, but around me, most ruckus about hoarding was made by people who thought COVID-19 is just a flu and were inconvenienced by queues. People who couldn't understand that you need a buffer.
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by gameswithgo on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @11:21AM (#22675306)
perhaps correctly a smear word, since you should have built your buffer up ahead of time?
Re:The Great Toilet Paper Scare of 1973 (2014) by TeMPOraL on Tuesday March 24, 2020 @01:44PM (#22676775)
Well, if the Lean methodology is so great for the entire supply chain, why it suddenly shouldn't be applied to the last link - the consumer? Building up a buffer is against just-in-time principle :P.

(The truth is, JIT supply chains simply aren't designed to survive events like a global pandemic. They're control systems overtuned to extract the last bits of efficiency from trade, and fall into bad oscillations when disruptions happen. As we can see today.)