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Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by Nasrudith on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @08:58AM (#22483757)
Part of the reason for floatation devices is a transitionary measure to get them more used to and practiced in "preswimming" while participating and not simply wading or pool side clinging.

They are just often misused - you are supposed to be supervising them when they are in the pool period and they only need deep enough water to keep their feet off the ground.

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by falcolas on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:18AM (#22483927)
Personal opinion, based off my own experience and teaching other children how to swim:

Flotation devices have no part to play in teaching how to swim. Parents (or teachers) holding their children and teaching them how to float is step 1. Only after the child can handle themselves in water (float, know when to breathe) should they be playing with flotation devices.

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by emacsen on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:24AM (#22483979)
I agree with this. I was very late to learn how to swim and only learned finally at around age 10.

Previous attempts to teach me to swim used flotation devices. Without them, I was terrified of drowning.

A very smart swimming teacher, seeing my fear, taught me to float on my back, first with her assistance, then without it. Once I could float, she taught me to swim backwards, froggy style. I was afraid even about that, but she said "If you ever find yourself unable to swim, just float!" and I felt confident to do that.

From there, I was comfortable swimming on my front, because once again, I knew how to go on my back and float!

Then the rest was simple skill acquisition.

30 years later, I wish I knew the name of that swim instructor!

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by alistairSH on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:25AM (#22483984)
We should clarify that PFDs (life-jackets) are probably good for young children and new swimmers. It's the floating toys that might actually be harmful.

And one skill that swimmers need, but cannot really get with an float-assist device, is putting their face in the water. I watched an adult friend learn to swim, and this was REALLY hard for him. Crazy enough - he was ex-Royal Navy submariner, so he had passed basic water survival - he could float on his back, just couldn't do anything beyond that.

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by falcolas on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:47AM (#22484140)
PFDs are a safety device, they’re great. If you think your child might be unsupervised, putting one on is safer than not. But as a teaching aide, they’re terrible.

You can’t swim with a lifejacket. You can only float (and in a position that is different from how you would naturally float in water).

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by alistairSH on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:02AM (#22484272)
Yeah, I wasn't super clear - PFDs are great if a new swimmer just needs to be in the water. My nephews used them at the beach when they were toddlers. But swim lessons were mom/dad/instructor holding them in the water.
Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by keanzu on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:41AM (#22484093)
> cannot really get with an float-assist device, is putting their face in the water.

We used kickboards for this exact purpose. So you can float face down with arms outstretched holding the board. You can transition to freestyle swimming taking one hand off the board at a time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iM3z1eDDcGE

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by AstralStorm on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:13AM (#22484382)
So it was practised for teaching swimming here in Poland at schools, but these are always in a very shallow pool and supervised too.

They lack the failure mode of floating face down in water, but instead are unsafe to others who can be hit with them. And kids will collide.

The newer foam ones are much softer and safer.

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by _ph_ on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:34AM (#22484582)
We used the same in school - mostly for training leg movements. Back then, everyone had basic swimming capabilities. But these kickboards are a totally different story than the blue donuts in the videos.
Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by astura on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:28AM (#22484532)
Weird they'd allow that, in the US you have to be able to swim a lap to graduate from Navy bootcamp, no matter which job you're going into.
Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by inanutshellus on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:49AM (#22484159)
Arm floaties are a crutch that ought never be used. If your kid isn't strong enough to swim on their own, don't give yourself the false sense of security that comes with floaties.

As an anecdote, they almost killed a friend's daughter a few years ago.

She had jumped and fallen forward, and her arm floaties moved her buoyancy to her stomach-area, forcing her face into the water. Scary stuff.

She was even in a swimming pool she could stand in.

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by dangerbird2 on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:11AM (#22484364)
A real life jacket approved by the USCG or similar agency may be more expensive than water wings, but unlike cheap water wings, they are designed to keep the wearer's face out of the water. A type I or II jacket can turn some or most unconsious wearers rightside up.

https://www.boatus.org/life-jackets/types/

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by mrob on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:48AM (#22484721)
I learned to swim using a float shaped like a miniature surfboard that I held out in front of me. This was both supervised and done in water shallow enough that I could stand with my head above the surface. If I had not been allowed access to this I am certain that I would have refused to go in the water at all (I was already very reluctant to do so even with the float).
Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by dangerbird2 on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @10:03AM (#22484276)
Someone who can't swim on their own should only ever use a coastguard-approved lifejacket or other personal floatation device. because of the risk of users falling off, Float toys like inner tubes, rafts, etc are only safe for swimmers. If the pool is busy, it's probably safter just to prohibit non-pfd, since they can obscure the view of the pool floor. Unapproved floats, especially water wings, run the risk of deflating or placing a non-swimmer in a position where his or her face is underwater.

Also, when I was a lifeguard, one of the things that was sometimes hard to get to parents' heads is that "supervising" a non-swimmer does not mean sitting on the side of the pool reading a book--it's being in the water no more than an arm's length of the nonswimmer. Every second is critical in a drowning incident, so having a parent less than a meter away will almost always do a better job rescuing a kid than a lifeguard in preventing an accident

Re:Spot the Drowning Child (2015) by dragonwriter on Wednesday March 04, 2020 @09:30AM (#22484016)
> Part of the reason for floatation devices is a transitionary measure to get them more used to and practiced in "preswimming" while participating and not simply wading or pool side clinging.

The reason for worn (handheld is a different story) flotation devices other than lifevests is to sell flotation devices; I've never found anyone who teaches swimming to children (or adults, but that's not the market for them anyway) that uses them, advises using them, or considers them anything other than a safety hazard.

If you want to get a kid used to “preswimming”, which as I've seen it is actually something mostly done with infants and toddlers (older nonswimmers usually seem to go straight from wall exercises to supervised short swimming with knowledgeable teachers) it's best to do it with an adult holding them, except for extremely brief transitions.