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Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by dooglius on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @08:07AM (#22308461)
Did you mean "does not rule out misdiagnosis"?

Going further than misdiagnosis, how many congenitally blind people are even tested for schizophrenia? Maybe lack of visual hallucinations make it less likely someone would get to the point of a test at all?

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by bildung on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @08:16AM (#22308526)
> Maybe lack of visual hallucinations make it less likely someone would get to the point of a test at all?

(I am not a psychologist!)

Visual hallucinations are not a hard criterion for diagnosing schizophrenia. They do occur, but the symptoms are more about delusions, disorganised thinking and catatonic symptoms. IIRC hallucinations are more often auditory, like hearing voices.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by dooglius on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @08:24AM (#22308574)
I know, that's not my point, I'm saying the barrier may be that a blind schizophrenic person may not even be aware that there's anything seriously wrong or worth bringing to a doctor's attention, so he would never get to the point of a psych evaluation.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by stef25 on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @09:46AM (#22309172)
They would still exhibit bizarre behavior, delusions, paranoia, catatonia etc. Patients heavily rely on family & friends to help manage their illness. It's very much something all-encompassing.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by bildung on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @08:35AM (#22308661)
Then by definition they wouldn't be mentally ill, as mental disorders have to cause significant distress for the patients to be diagnosed as such.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by sopooneo on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @09:29AM (#22309055)
By this logic we are speculating that perhaps being blind from birth blocks the symptoms of schizophrenia to the point that it is no longer a "disease". I don't know if this is correct, but a compelling idea.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by frenchyatwork on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @12:07PM (#22310541)
Yeah that would be the speculation: that blind schizophrenics are asymptomatic.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by dooglius on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @09:46AM (#22309171)
I think you are assuming that significant distress will result in awareness that the distress is medically significant.
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by bildung on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:10AM (#22309373)
I have no assumptions about schizophrenia, I just paraphrased how the definitions of the ICD-10 work. The fact of suffering is the distinction between a mental disorder and a quirky personality.

Think of it as a continuous spectrum from the idealized normal person (the center of a bell curve) to the person having significant problems living a normal, fulfilling life. The eccentric personality is somewhere in between.

This is all about definitions. The ICD-10 and similar categorizations essentially work by listing a number of symptons and a minimum count of symptoms a patient has to have to be diagnosed according to this definition. They don't make any assumptions about disorders existing per se.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by jacobush on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @09:03AM (#22308860)
It can be distress which is missed by the doctor.

I think it's far more acceptable for us to "mishear" something and think nothing of it. The seeing also have the backup sense, sight to verify much of what we hear.

"I heard the sound of an elephant stomping around in my living room."

This statement made by a seeing person could be made by nobody thinking much of it. I wouldn't immediately ask if they actually thought an elephant were in the living room at the time.

The same statement made by a (blind) schizophrenic person could have implied that the person actually believed there was an elephant in the living room, but the clinician might have missed the significance and not asked follow up questions.

A bit of a contrived example, but you get the gist.

To a seeing person it might

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by Ensorceled on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @12:41PM (#22310839)
This theory depends on hundreds, maybe thousands of doctors and peditricians, many of whom would be specialists focusing on blind patients, a similar number of teachers, social workers, care takers, blind training centers staff, parents ... ALL missed schizophrenia, which is often a debilitating illness, because they are "sighted".
Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by whiddershins on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @08:34AM (#22308655)
That’s confusing. Schizophrenia is horribly unpleasant for the person who has it, they aren’t “tested” so much as they are suffering terribly and seek help and are then given a diagnosis.

It’s not like screening people for spectrum or personality disorders.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by bluGill on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @10:04AM (#22309321)
I the schizophrenic people I know are afraid of authority and avoid anything that might diagnose them. It takes a forceful family member to get them to a doctor (or in one case the prison system), and constant attention to get them to take the treatments. In general if they are not a harm to society or themselves it is best to let them live alone in a small town (small town because it gives the town gossips something useful to talk about: the talk helps ensure everybody knows to watch out for the victim, and small ensures even new people in town know about the situation)

Note, my sample size is far too small to draw universal conclusions about schizophrenic.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by vintermann on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @04:51PM (#22313195)
> the schizophrenic people I know are afraid of authority and avoid anything that might diagnose them.

Since blind people need to rely on others a lot more than people with sight, I think it would be even harder for them to avoid medical authorities than for other schizophrenics. For what it's worth, the schizophrenics I knew personally were not averse to seeking help for their condition, but were very distressed by side effects from medication (understandably!)

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by wahern on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @05:06PM (#22313329)
> Schizophrenia is horribly unpleasant for the person who has it

There's a strong cultural component to how schizophrenia manifests. Violent, paranoid thoughts are more common in societies like the United States. The extent to which their experiences can fit into a positive cultural narrative partly dictates their quality of life. The U.S. is exceedingly hostile in that regard. You're likely better off in a society where hearing voices is considered a gift from the gods, or where perceiving odd but intriguing cause+effect relationships suggests you can sense magic.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by wahern on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @07:48PM (#22314374)
Metasource: https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2014/07/when-hear... ("But a new study suggests that the way schizophrenia sufferers experience those voices depends on their cultural context.")

Googling will show similar reporting in the literature over several decades. I don't think I've seen any contradictory research, though that's not surprising as this is just an interesting observation; there aren't any sophisticated, concrete explanatory models to critique--individualist vs collectivist dichotomy seems intuitive but not concrete on its own. Rather the focus seems to be on pragmatic therapy. It's noteworthy nonetheless, particularly as a reflection of American society, and of how culture informs pathology, a point usually made regarding more touchy-feely mental health issues and thus lacking punch.

Re:No person who was born blind has ever been diagnosed with... by stef25 on Wednesday February 12, 2020 @09:42AM (#22309145)
Visual hallucinations are not at all the main symptoms of schizophrenia. Besides, blind people do "see things" under the influence of psychedelics.