> What really had my brain going is why is this not the case in the Western Europe?

Can you explain? Western Europe by and large suffers from the same problem. According to Brookings (https://www.brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/ccf_201...), while the US has a faster rate of male labor de-participation, the UK, Canada, and France are experiencing similar issues (Figure 2). No idea about the cause though.

The article says that in Western Europe the rate at which men drop out is much lower than in the US. I only had the article as a frame of reference for my question, I did not have the Brookings institution study for additional color. Interesting reading, thank you.

In Europe the benefits are not necessarily tied to being diagnosed with a disabling condition. In the US they are, so people do what they can to manifest a disabling condition so that they can qualify for generous benefits along with drugs that can be resold on the black market. Clearly this was not the intended result but it's sort of a third rail politically so there has been no real movement towards reforming this in any meaningful direction.

Could be the difference in pay for low wage jobs. It seems that this is what it comes down to.

Many male, high-school dropouts have decided it's a better deal to just coast by on disability and money from friends/family then to work for $10/hour at McDonald's or similar.

The way to bring them back into the workforce, IMO, is to offer them a better deal. If low-wage jobs in the U.S. were as good as they are in Eastern Europe, maybe more men would take them.

Another person commented below what I think is brilliant insight.

"In America (USA) you ARE your job; it defines you. The American Way is to be hard working and self sufficient. If you can't do that, there are tremendous psychological effects. You can't blame these men for giving up."

It is absolutely true that worth and career are highly correlated here in the US. Most of us talk about work even when we aren't at work. I think this is probably the big difference between US and Europe having read it.

Meh. The idea that Americans talk only about their job is mainly only true in the upper classes of professionals. Most Americans, the poor and lower middle class, do not talk about their jobs, because talking about being a taxi driver or walmart greeter is not as engaging as talking about being an investment banker, lawyer, or software engineer.

FWIW, the same is true in Europe. Rich people define themselves by the method in which they get rich.

> Most of us talk about work even when we aren't at work

People on hacker news are mostly upper middle class.

Another way to phrase that is that jobs at the lower end are not worth talking about. They're not a point of pride. Combine that with the GP notion that people use their job as part of their identity and what does that do to their self esteem?

> If low-wage jobs in the U.S. were as good as they are in Eastern Europe, maybe more men would take them.

Are you saying low wage wage jobs are good in EE? I can assure you that's not the case. Millions of low wage workes from EE left for Western Europe upon joining the EU. They still do low wage work, but the pay is so much higher in the UK, Germany, Norway etc.

In Germany, you can receive partial disability benefits ("Erwerbsminderungsrente"); that is, you might be evaluated as being capable of 3-6 hours of work per day, and thus receive only a portion of what would have been your full disability payment. Also, it's accepted (even hoped) that you might become fully fit again.

https://www.deutsche-rentenversicherung.de/DRV/EN/Leistungen... (under "Invalidity pension")

More details in German: https://www.deutsche-rentenversicherung.de/DRV/DE/Rente/Allg...

> Disability is a federal benefit (not state)...

Maybe in the state in which you live. I am currently on state (CA) disability.

-- which will expire after you've been on it for 52 weeks [1] after which, if you still cannot work, you can resort to (US) federal disability insurance.

[1] https://ca.db101.org/ca/programs/income_support/sdi/faqs.htm...