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Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by mapcars on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @04:28AM (#21134377)
>those who tend to be more realistic in their self expectations are more prone to depression.

No, depression comes when you are only applying logic to life and essentially seeing that there is no meaning to it. Logic can not live without meaning, but life is tremendously bigger that our limited logic, regardless how fanciful we make it.

>False confidence may be the route to happiness or at least optimism.

No, this comes from the same point of view. Actually there is no route to happiness because it's here already. There are only routes away and making logic dominating in your life is one of them.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by afishisafish on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @10:53AM (#21137099)
to quote Bill Hicks

>The world is like a ride in an amusement park

https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/494647-the-world-is-like-a-...

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by tomp on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @07:30AM (#21135269)
Logic tells me there's no objective meaning to life. Logic also tells me that I can pick whatever subjective meaning (for life, myself, my actions, people around me and whatever else).
Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by heavenlyblue on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @05:22AM (#21134628)
>> depression comes when you are only applying logic to life and essentially seeing that there is no meaning to it.

Depression is not a question of philosophy of your life.

Philosophy may help you approach the depression, but you can’t get depressed because life is too logical - you may get sad, on the other hand.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by AnIdiotOnTheNet on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @10:58AM (#21137152)
> Depression is not a question of philosophy of your life.

Oh I strongly disagree with this assessment. I am not a psychologist, but have suffered from depression on and off my whole life, and I assert that depression is indeed a philosophical problem.

Depression, I think, is the experience of one's mind realizing that its model of reality (philosophy) is too flawed or incomplete to see a concrete path towards meaningful change in one's life, and attempting to build a better model.

This is evidenced by:

1) depressive realism. the mind is being careful to make more accurate assessments.

2) a preference towards inaction. The mind does not trust its model of reality, and is reluctant to take actions with unpredictable results.

3) similar behavior in children undergoing cognitive schema shifts.

Further, I assert that part of the reason society is unable to effect meaningful treatment (for lack of a better word) of many cases of depression is that society's baseline philosophy (empiricism) is part of the model known by the subject to be flawed, and so it has no pre-existing better model to guide the individual towards (though I contend such models do exist if actively sought).

Depression, in my experience, is overcome in only 2 ways:

1) The mind gives up and returns to its previous, known flawed, philosophy and simply rejects the information that highlighted the flaws. This is an unstable state prone to relapse for obvious reasons. In the worst cases, the subject seeks to actively destroy the source of such information. This, I suspect, is essentially the cause of religious or ideological violence.

2) The mind constructs a better model that allows it to once again place confidence in its prediction of the outcomes of its actions. This is more stable, but the new model may still have significant flaws that will ultimate result in a new round of depression.

Needless to say for anyone who has actually been through severe depression, the experience is intensely unpleasant. If a mind is unable to resolve the dissonance between its current model and reality, it may take desperate action to relieve this suffering.

Anyways, I guess what I'm saying is that if my hypothesis is accurate then you can indeed become depressed from trying to apply logic to your life and discovering that logic (empirical logic anyway) alone is not sufficient.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by rewgs on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @01:44PM (#21138962)
This is the most accurate description of my depression and why it is seemingly impervious to therapy. It's not debilitating to the point of not being able to function in daily life, but is instead a constant, low-grade friction resulting in less drive and confidence and more inaction. Basically, life has taught me that my self-esteem was misguided, and I'm unsure of how to meaningfully act without it, so I just sort of fade away.
Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by heavenlyblue on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @01:01PM (#21138570)
Well, if you know that every time you've built a mental model and it didn't work, isn't that logical to assume that _any_ mental model you can imagine isn't perfect and thus you can't empirically assume it will work all the time?

I hear your opinion of "logic" as "I have a passion for being right, and it makes me unhappy when I am not". Is that logical?

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by dropit_sphere on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @12:34PM (#21138308)
baller comment, just wanted to say
Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by mapcars on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @05:36AM (#21134702)
>but you can’t get depressed because life is too logical

Can you elaborate? In my experience this is pretty much the only reason for depression, eg life does not happen how your logic tells you it suppose to happen.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by newshorts on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @06:16AM (#21134867)
Given the articles subject, I’d like to clarify...

Are you an authority or somehow involved in research on depression? Or are you simply feigning knowledge on a subject you know little or nothing about?

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by mapcars on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @07:00AM (#21135093)
I don't have anything to support what I'm saying nor I need to. My knowledge does not come from a billion dollar research, and it does not have to. The question is only are you looking for a solution or a solution proven by authorities of your choice.
Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by AbitofAsum on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @08:27AM (#21135632)
This statement, given the previous comments and the context of the article, belies a certain depth, a conundrum I find myself facing periodically.

The basic notion being that, that which we believe, is true. This is nonsense on the face of it. Being nonsense doesn't prevent it from being a seemingly fundamental and perplexing aspect of being a human.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by bookofjoe on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @08:28AM (#21135635)
"Love is giving something you don't have to someone who doesn't exist."—Jacques Lacan

Generalizable to: Life has no meaning, but we can give it a meaning.

Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by bookofjoe on Friday October 11, 2019 @11:35AM (#21225373)
Also: "Divorce is taking things you no longer want from people you no longer love."—Zadie Smith
Re:We Are All Confident Idiots (2014) by mapcars on Wednesday October 02, 2019 @09:07AM (#21135970)
With this I agree, the problem comes when we forget we give meaning and we become too serious about something we made up.