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Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by ineedasername on Saturday September 07, 2019 @09:04AM (#20903514)
Collaborating on scientific endeavors is not the same as a single world government. It also doesn't account for way we and other countries do collaborate on large scientific projects, such as the LHC. Then there are the technologies that India and other countries have not developed themselves, but instead acquire or license and avoid having to reinvent the wheel, and come to understand themselves much faster than starting from zero.

India would not be dependent on the US if we used some of our expertise to teach them. It doesn't have to a black box that "just works" without any understanding of it. There's also no reason knowledge sharing couldn't take in the context of market economics. The experts that helped India wouldn't be working for free. It also doesn't have to contradict different interests, values, etc.: Vastly different groups can still have some areas of collective self-interest that coincide. India for example is the world's largest Democracy. That alone is a good reason for the US to want to help make them successful and provide to them scientific help that advances their society and thereby assists in their long term stability.

Unrelated: Your profile, "cognitive radio" sounds fascinating!

Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by rayiner on Saturday September 07, 2019 @09:09AM (#20903545)
I don’t disagree with that concept, but note that a lot of international cooperation that exists presently doesn’t help countries like India develop their own technology. Putting Indian astronauts or experiments on American space missions, for example. Taking their own shot at going to the moon, independent of US efforts, is an important step forward for India.
Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by ineedasername on Saturday September 07, 2019 @10:42AM (#20904028)
That current cooperation may not be geared towards knowledge transfer doesn't mean it couldn't be. For example the US helped Great Britain extensively in the 60's and 70's on the space front and other areas, not to the extent that the UK was unable to do it themselves but to successfully boot strap their efforts.

There's other examples too: Despite a chilly relationship and very different values, the US and Russia have worked together for two decades on the ISS. The world is littered with current projects or their results that involved significant international cooperation and shared expertise.

The argument that it shouldn't happen, or isn't in countries' best interests, or not with India in this case-- those might be interesting ideas to explore, but that doesn't mean it can't or doesn't happen successfully. Practically no country has independently built all of the technology that it both uses, fully understands, and can now produce on its own. What we're really talking about here is teaching-- teaching another country how to do something. I don't need how teaching necessarily disadvantages the student country. It doesn't replace their own initiative to learn and internalize the material, but it does bootstrap the process.

Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by LegitShady on Saturday September 07, 2019 @02:36PM (#20905645)
>That current cooperation may not be geared towards knowledge transfer doesn't mean it couldn't be. For example the US helped Great Britain extensively in the 60's and 70's on the space front and other areas, not to the extent that the UK was unable to do it themselves but to successfully boot strap their efforts.

The problem is there is a big crossover between space tech and missile tech, so you have to see that other country as a very close ally to start that kind of tech transfer.

>There's other examples too: Despite a chilly relationship and very different values, the US and Russia have worked together for two decades on the ISS. The world is littered with current projects or their results that involved significant international cooperation and shared expertise.

All tech they both already had.

> Practically no country has independently built all of the technology that it both uses, fully understands, and can now produce on its own.

That isn't an argument for choosing to transfer a particular technology to a particular country.

>What we're really talking about here is teaching-- teaching another country how to do something. I don't need how teaching necessarily disadvantages the student country. It doesn't replace their own initiative to learn and internalize the material, but it does bootstrap the process.

It makes that tech much more easily spread in an age where the west is already worrying about North Korea/Iran/etc's long range missile programs (which they are collaborating on!, point you, but thats a reason why not to share technology willy nilly, point me).

Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by greglindahl on Saturday September 07, 2019 @07:33PM (#20907413)
Wait, what? The US has no rule against Indian astronauts flying to the ISS, or Indian hardware flying on American-led space missions. This very Indian mission had US hardware on it, in exchange for DSN time. Similarly, India's Mars mission had some NASA cooperation. All of this is easily discovered information.
Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by detaro on Saturday September 07, 2019 @07:35PM (#20907432)
Parent didn't say that such cooperation doesn't exist? But that it doesn't transfer all knowledge on how to do it.
Re:India Loses Contact with Probe Just as It Prepares to Lan... by greglindahl on Saturday September 07, 2019 @07:49PM (#20907497)
Uh, OK, that's not what I thought parent said.

There's actually tons of knowledge transfer, everything but ITAR. For example, NASA publishes a lot of information in the open, as long as it's not ITAR-restricted.