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Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by reaperducer on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @08:46PM (#20815858)
The pentagram at the bottom left of the video is an instant deal-breaker for millions of regular folks

Yeah, it's a little tone-deaf.

I understand it's meant to be tongue-in-cheek and all that. But if, for example, they used a swastika, even if they were using it in the context one of the dozens of cultures for whom it's a normal symbol, it would still be tone deaf.

A lot of people here are saying it's just a symbol, etc... But if it was a Christian cross, I bet a lot of HN readers would flinch with "I'm not supporting some fundy company!"

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by bscphil on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @09:46PM (#20816148)
> A lot of people here are saying it's just a symbol, etc... But if it was a Christian cross, I bet a lot of HN readers would flinch with "I'm not supporting some fundy company!"

I... sort of agree with you. It's generally desirable to make your products acceptable to everyone you can, and so the decision to include a pentagram is probably poorly calculated.

But on the other hand, the sort of people who would put a cross symbol in the corner of a video are probably for-real fundies, while it's obviously extremely unlikely that anyone involved in the making of this video is a for-real Satanist (in the religious sense of the term). So I think there might be some justification for differential treatment on the basis of this context.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by lostgame on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @10:25PM (#20816336)
Alright, once again, stepping in here to be clear and specific: in no way is an upright pentagram 'Satanic'.

The upside down pentagram 'symbol of Satan' isn't even the symbol of Satan. It's a symbol of the goat's head of Baphomet, which, yes, is on the cover of the LaVeyan Satanic bible, which, um, claims Satan doesn't exist, and worshipping 'Satan' is ignorant and stupid.

The upright pentagram is used in Ceremonial Magick, in fact, as part of a banishing ritual, the aim of which is to literally banish any negative energies or entities.

It baffles me to think of the upright pentagram symbol as anything but sacred.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by inflatableDodo on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @10:43PM (#20816411)
>in no way is an upright pentagram 'Satanic'.

Broadly speaking, though I think it does depend on context. For instance, if practicing Satanists have attached a sacrificial victim to an upright pentagram, in order to worship Satan, then even if there may be a symbolic error on their part, that particular upright pentagram could safely be called Satanic and Satan would probably overlook the oversight.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by lostgame on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @11:20PM (#20816547)
But...Satanists don't worship Satan.

The Church of Satan doesn’t believe in the devil. It doesn’t even recognise ‘Satan’ as a physical or spiritual being. As far as the Church is concerned, there is no such thing as heaven or hell.

And human sacrifice? Like, that kind of thing might happen in the Highest Orders of the Left-Hand Path, the Skull and Bones-type societies George W. Bush was a part of - so conspirators claim - like, I want to be expressly clear that suggesting Satanists make human sacrifices is akin to saying all Muslims are terrorists. Seriously. You're just discrediting a group of people who have enough troubles being recognized as valid to start.

I assure you, I have visited branches of the Church of Satan, and they are actually filled generally with very good people, whose philosophy is mostly that of self-love and not taking any bullshit, combined with the dogmatic practice of Ceremonial Magick.

It just wasn't my cup of tea. I have enjoyed more of what I've seen from Thelemic orders, which do not identify as Satanic.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by ralusek on Wednesday August 28, 2019 @03:08AM (#20817569)
I know that HackerNews isn't reddit, but I couldn't resist.

https://i.imgflip.com/392ehi.jpg

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by inflatableDodo on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @11:48PM (#20816625)
The Church of Satan is just a way of selling libertarian humanism to the dissaffected children of middle class Christians, by inverting some biblical tropes and going woo a lot though. I tend to think of actual Satanists to be more like the mental ones found in European royalty during the medieval period.
Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by lostgame on Wednesday August 28, 2019 @12:04AM (#20816688)
Hey - not my cup of tea, either, as I said - but I am saying lumping Satanists and human sacrifice together is like lumping Muslims and terrorism together.

Sure, it might happen, in only the most extreme cases, but it's certainly not the norm, and it makes people who try to take their faith seriously - even if, yes, LaVeyan Satanism is simply libertarian humanism combined with, quite honestly, a fairly weak system of Ceremonial Magick, if it makes them happy, let them do it.

I don't agree with Catholicism, either, but I'm not running around saying all priests rape little boys, even though there is far more evidence of that, than actual human sacrifice in Satanism.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by inflatableDodo on Wednesday August 28, 2019 @12:47AM (#20816863)
I think the clearest distinguishing line that can be broadly drawn, is between followers of theistic and non-theistic Satanism.

The latter do tend towards being the awfully nice people you've been describing, who are always making sure that everyone is fine in the mosh pit.

The former, however, can conversely tend towards the type of person who is far too enthusiastic about the technical details of the blood gutters in their unnervingly large collection of ceremonial knives.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by lostgame on Wednesday August 28, 2019 @10:26AM (#20820082)
In my years of practicing Ceremonial Magick, in and out of various Orders, and my studies of Satanism, I have never met such people, would consider them an extreme rarity, and again, would draw the Musilms are terrorists parallel.

There are plenty of theistic Satanists I know who are also great people.

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by inflatableDodo on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @09:37PM (#20816118)
One of the clear messages I get from looking at the past couple of thousand years of history is that I should really try and avoid getting hung up on symbols. Also looking to history, it is remarks such as this that will probably lead to that outcome.
Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by reaperducer on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @09:43PM (#20816140)
That's great if you're Mr. Spock and the rest of the world is a bunch of Vulcans who can control their brains in the most logical way. But human beings create connections in their brains, and the whole purpose of symbols is to create a connection.

If you use a symbol that has a particular widespread meaning, then people are going to think of that meaning when you use the symbol, even if they then figure out what you really mean a second or two later.

That's why companies trademark logos, and why other companies trying to associate themselves with those companies try to make their logos look similar. (Think of all the knock-off Starbucks-themed coffee shops around the world.)

Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by inflatableDodo on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @09:46PM (#20816147)
Oh this is fun. I'm going to wait just a little longer...
Re:A mobile phone that respects your freedom [video] by RandomBacon on Tuesday August 27, 2019 @11:21PM (#20816553)
This section of the comments is... interesting. I wasn't expecting to read about this kind of stuff on HN today. But it's not over-the-top or obnoxious, so it's interesting to learn a little about what other people do/believe/practice.