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A comment on Terminating Service for 8Chan. Parent comment

Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by leereeves on Monday August 05, 2019 @10:24AM (#20614446)
Both you and Vox are trying to limit the discussion to gun crime, as if knife crime or acid attacks or bombings or mass vehicular homicides don't matter. That's misleading and borderline dishonest. It's the violence that matters, not the weapon.
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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by throw0101a on Monday August 05, 2019 @02:56PM (#20617322)
In December 2012, a crazed man entered an elementary school and attacked several staff members and students. He used a kitchen knife and while there were 24 injuries, there were zero deaths:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chenpeng_Village_Primary_Schoo...

A little while later, another crazed man entered a second elementary school and also attacked staff and students. He used an XM15 and Glock 20SF; there were 2 injuries and 28 deaths:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sandy_Hook_Elementary_School_s...

> It's the violence that matters, not the weapon.

I'm guessing you have never read Marshal McLuhan. The tools (communication or otherwise) that humans have available shape society and our perception of the world. There are daily examples (both negligent and purposeful) of people acting in a way that they probably would not have if they only had knives or just their fists:

* https://twitter.com/well_regulated_

The effects of different tools are... different. The "Garlic shooter" was able to kill 3 people and injure many more before he was taken out in under 60 seconds:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilroy_Garlic_Festival_shootin...

That kind of carnage is difficult to achieve with a baseball bat or a knife.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by eropple on Monday August 05, 2019 @10:28AM (#20614466)
And the effort required to kill a number of people with a gun is significantly less--like, to the point where the "but but what about that?" verges on ludicrous--than knife crime or acid attacks. Gun violence requires less specialized knowledge and provides fewer opportunities to catch a criminal before their plan goes off than bombings. And vehicles have overwhelmingly more legitimate use than guns that present a meaningful and socially valid argument against their restriction where guns have no such value.

Which is why this is low-hanging fruit to deal with and long past due.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by leereeves on Monday August 05, 2019 @10:37AM (#20614543)
The vast majority of killers aren't aiming to kill a lot of people. Just one, usually. You're focusing on the dramatic mass killings instead of the significant majority of murderers, who could switch to knives and acid.

And then there are the mass killers, but since vehicles won't be banned because they have "overwhelmingly more legitimate use", they would remain available for mass killings. As would bombs, though that does require more skill than the other weapons.

And guns would remain available too. Gun control does very little to prevent criminals from obtaining guns, as the gun crime rate in Chicago shows.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by throw0101a on Monday August 05, 2019 @03:01PM (#20617404)
> The vast majority of killers aren't aiming to kill a lot of people.

The amount of low-level carnage that happens daily in the US from either incompetent, negligent, or malicious gun owners is quite impressive:

* https://twitter.com/Well_Regulated_/status/11575509903437127...

* https://twitter.com/Well_Regulated_/status/11578845404777594...

* https://twitter.com/Well_Regulated_/status/11581452335924346...

* https://twitter.com/Well_Regulated_/status/11582078708082647...

A total ban on firearms isn't even necessary; just a filter on the dumb asses and hot heads:

* https://www.vox.com/2018/11/13/17658028/massachusetts-gun-co...

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by jakelazaroff on Monday August 05, 2019 @10:55AM (#20614668)
> And then there are the mass killers, but since vehicles won't be banned because they have "overwhelmingly more legitimate use", they would remain available for mass killings.

Yet curiously, almost all mass murders are committed with guns, not vehicles.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by leereeves on Monday August 05, 2019 @11:04AM (#20614745)
The ones you hear about, because there's a political agenda behind publicizing them.

Have you heard about any of these?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle-ramming_attack

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by throw0101a on Wednesday August 07, 2019 @08:18AM (#20633973)
You don't hear a lot about many of them because there are only so many hours in the day:

* https://www.gunviolencearchive.org/reports/mass-shooting

Compare the list of Canada which fits on one page (going back to 1689):

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_massacres_in_Canada

to the US, which has page-per-year breakdowns:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_the_...

Canada has the sixth-highest firearm ownership rate, yet has a death rate lower than many EU countries:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estimated_number_of_civilian_g...

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_firearm-r...

So firearms aren't alien to Canadians, and yet the number of blood baths occurring is much, much lower. Incidents do occur:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toronto_van_attack

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_Toronto_shooting

but much less frequently.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by jakelazaroff on Monday August 05, 2019 @11:29AM (#20614932)
You say political agenda, but your own source lists the most recent vehicle attack as occurring last year, and no casualties occurred. Multiple mass shootings have claimed tens of lives in the past few days alone.
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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by leereeves on Monday August 05, 2019 @12:06PM (#20615211)
Are we reading the same page?

The most recent attack listed in my source was in March of this year and killed six.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zaoyang_car_attack

And that's just the last time someone added one to the page. I doubt the list is comprehensive or that was the last attack.

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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by toyg on Monday August 05, 2019 @12:43PM (#20615589)
He clearly meant the last attack on American soil.
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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by leereeves on Monday August 05, 2019 @01:22PM (#20616048)
I think we all agree American murderers prefer to use guns rather than vehicles or acid. That's our culture. But it's not worse than other cultures where murderers prefer to use acid or knives or vehicles or bombs.
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Re:Terminating Service for 8Chan by jakelazaroff on Tuesday August 06, 2019 @07:44AM (#20624267)
It's a pragmatic preference, not a cultural one: guns are much better murder weapons than cars.
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