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Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by forinti on Saturday August 03, 2019 @06:08PM (#20603002)
It's not just that it's slow, it also uses a lot of energy compared to the amount of calculation that it does.

Apple II: 0.43 Mips @ 17W

RPi3B: 1822 Mips @ 1.2W

So I wonder if there is a solution as energy efficient as modern hardware, but as slow as 8 bit machines.

Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by sehugg on Saturday August 03, 2019 @06:56PM (#20603242)
Ultra-low-power MCUs are ~80 μA/MHz, so yes, you can get there. Bitcoin doesn't require a lot of RAM, which helps power consumption significantly.
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by Veedrac on Saturday August 03, 2019 @10:15PM (#20604054)
Worth noting that even the lowest power microcontroller will presumably run circles around an old 8-bit architecture.
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by rarecoil on Saturday August 03, 2019 @10:49PM (#20604160)
This calculation makes me curious, as I know very little about computer engineering/hardware but want to learn: what is the current-most energy-efficient general CPU architecture/core in performance-per-watt? Some high-speed ARM? A Y-series x86?
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by blueboo on Sunday August 04, 2019 @03:50AM (#20605043)
This may not have the latest record, but lots of interesting and relevant info here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Performance_per_watt

https://streamhpc.com/blog/2012-08-27/processors-that-can-do... is interesting too, though obviously out of date, but might reflect how GPUs are efficient as are the latest CPUs with their smaller lithography.

Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by wiz21c on Sunday August 04, 2019 @05:58AM (#20605489)
>> Apple II: 0.43 Mips

This number seems quite optimistic to me (I've found it on wikipedia). It just happens I was coding for fun in assembly language on Apple II some weeks ago and the minimum opcode length is two cpu cycles, so I'd say at best we're at 0.5 mips (the apple is 1 Mhz). And for anything useful it'd be closer to 0.25 mips).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Instructions_per_second#cite_n...

http://www.6502.org/tutorials/6502opcodes.html

Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by segfaultbuserr on Saturday August 03, 2019 @06:40PM (#20603174)
Ultra-low-power 8-bit microcontrollers? 1 MIPS @ 1 W is possible on a AVR I believe, but still much less efficient than a modern CPU. Economic-of-scale at work, you can't compete with greater integration.
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by Rebelgecko on Saturday August 03, 2019 @08:38PM (#20603720)
FPGA with limited clock speed?
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by arcticbull on Saturday August 03, 2019 @09:59PM (#20603995)
FPGAs aren't particularly energy efficient compared to ASIC implementations of the same hardware.
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by bredren on Sunday August 04, 2019 @12:15AM (#20604390)
This is the point of FPGA in consumer products right? Ship the DVD player ASAP see if it sells then spin silicon.
Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by arcticbull on Sunday August 04, 2019 @11:40AM (#20607167)
Generally you don't ship FPGAs in consumer devices you plan to sell in high quantities, as they're very expensive in addition to not being very efficient. Small FPGAs or CPLDs can be used for low-volume devices to avoid the huge non-recoupable expenses of an ASIC spin -- because of the specific requirements of the application.

They're almost exclusively used for prototyping ASICs.

Re:Mining Bitcoin on an Apple II by unimployed on Saturday August 03, 2019 @09:26PM (#20603898)
Not sure an FPGA will output enough work to be economical. Probably still stuck with ASIC.