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Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by ronnier on Saturday August 03, 2019 @12:25PM (#20601172)
It’s not just Japan, but also a lot of the western world. People are getting married less often and having fewer children and my guess is that it’s largely driven by women opting out as they are a lot more selective in who they date and marry compared to men. Historically women didn’t have much of a say in the matter since they needed to marry for a better life since they lacked the freedoms or resources to go it alone. Now that women have gained their freedom and the resources to to survive on their own (higher rates of education, economy that supports high paying jobs that employees lots of women, etc), they can totally stay unmarried and have fulfilling lives in their social circles and wait until they can select exactly what they want. Men largely take what they can get, they are the selected. Women select. And of course this is just a generalization.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by nugget on Saturday August 03, 2019 @12:44PM (#20601315)
How do you ensure our society survives in such an environment? There’s a potential future where the birth rate in open and tolerant communities falls to near zero while the birth rate in closed, ultra orthodox (across numerous faiths and denominations) religious communities within which women are commanded to procreate remains high. If you watch a show like Handmaid’s Tale through this lens you can start to connect the hypothetical dots from here to there.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by freetime2 on Saturday August 03, 2019 @02:43PM (#20601923)
I think the solution is probably to make having children more attractive with government subsidies and labor laws. E.g. free daycare, affordable education (including college), health care, a minimum amount of paid time off per year, etc.

Nobody should be forced to get married or have children if they don’t want to. But if we can alleviate some of the risks/down sides to having children, I think we will see more people choosing to start families and also having more children per family.

Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by klntsky on Saturday August 03, 2019 @06:05PM (#20602982)
> to make having children more attractive with government subsidies and labor laws

This is a bad idea. Russian government have already tried that, and the result was that less wealthy people (mostly alcoholic and drug addicts) started to literally make children to receive subsidies and spend them on themselves.

It's fun to me how Google search results differ for "to make a child for subsidies" and for this same phrase translated to Russian, where it has already became a phenomenon.

Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by mlguy456 on Saturday August 03, 2019 @10:24PM (#20604083)
Subsidies can be tied up to mortgage: the entire cost of housing can be made deductible from taxes, all expenses related to kids can be reimbursed (by IRS in April: you show checks and they give you money back). On top of that your income can be backed by the government for an extended period of time in case something happens to you, while you still need to pay for everything. You may ask where do we get money for all this? Tax on wealth. Many countries tax investments at 1% a year, not income, but investments. This won't bankrupt the rich people because investments usually make 5-10% per year and the government can take a small fraction of that. And no, the rich won't move their money abroad because safety that the US gives is worth a lot.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by TFYS on Sunday August 04, 2019 @03:27AM (#20604973)
Many European countries have all those things and the birthrate is still falling.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by johnny22 on Saturday August 03, 2019 @05:56PM (#20602931)
Isn't it likely that those ultra orthodox societies would repeat the cycle and we'd still end up back here anyways? It's not like the current situation sprung up out of nothing.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by HenryKissinger on Saturday August 03, 2019 @10:21PM (#20604073)
Artificial wombs.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by imtringued on Monday August 05, 2019 @06:05AM (#20612770)
Making babies isn't the hard part.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by malandrew on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:08PM (#20601439)
Liberalism needs to evolve to incorporate the family and procreation into its philosophies and worldview if it wants to continue having an influence.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by hellisothers on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:22PM (#20601516)
Seems like you’re saying liberalism is anti-those-things but it’s not, it is anti-coercion though and if that has historically been the solution to what you describe then I could see one drawing that conclusion.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by hellisothers on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:11PM (#20601455)
How about men could stop doing the things that make women not select them?
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by danharaj on Saturday August 03, 2019 @12:33PM (#20601236)
Or maybe, it's too expensive to start a family these days.

Or people grew up watching their parents regret starting one too soon and want to avoid that mistake.

People who talk about women being more selective makes me wonder if there's an ulterior motive to choosing that hypothesis. Sour grapes?

Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by rectang on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:19PM (#20601494)
> Or maybe, it's too expensive to start a family these days.

There's much more economic uncertainty for the average family as a result of two things.

1. Corporations innovating the labor market and successfully squeezing increasing amounts of wealth out of the workforce: successful union busting, ever more cleverly exploitative labor contracts, the gig economy, unpredictable scheduling, metrics and surveillance, etc.

2. Fewer funds proportionally available to labor thanks to increasing wealth capture by a tiny minority.

It's not only expensive, but it's statistically difficult to overcome the uncertainty and establish a homestead you can believe will prove stable over a kid-raising time frame.

It's easy to understand why people are hesitant to start families in such family-unfriendly economic conditions.

Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by mlguy456 on Saturday August 03, 2019 @10:34PM (#20604116)
Simple solution: 1%/year tax on wealth and give these money to families with kids. The tricky part is wealth is often stored as shares and if you tax Bezos, he'd have to sell 1% of his shares, thus driving the price of those shares down; then if some hedge fund keeps buying the shares he sells, eventually he may lose control over his company, which is unfair. We might want to define wealth as savings above 5M dollars. This would be easy to work around: register a few companies with highly complex structure of ownership and spread money across them.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by dgzl on Saturday August 03, 2019 @12:43PM (#20601307)
I agree with the GP, women are more selective these days. I've been in the dating pool a while and things are changing in weird ways.

Sexually speaking, the rich get richer and the poor get poorer.

Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by dfcmt on Saturday August 03, 2019 @12:36PM (#20601259)
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by AnthonyMouse on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:25PM (#20601539)
The implication of that chart is that women are increasingly having sex with the men who have sex with multiple women.
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Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by nyolfen on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:02PM (#20601416)
so you think this lack of hygiene or whatever has tripled in the last ten years or what? this betrays a total lack of consideration. sexual market dynamics are shifting rapidly.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by danharaj on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:23PM (#20601529)
I'll give you a hint: Using a market analogy for intimate relationships is not attractive, it's creepy.
Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by nyolfen on Saturday August 03, 2019 @01:36PM (#20601597)
i don't call my girlfriend my customer, it's a completely appropriate metaphor when speaking about culture-level aggregate effects. you should reflect on why all of your responses in this thread boil down to attacks on a perceived outgroup instead of engagement with ideas.
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Re:Japan's Women Opt Out of Marriage by johnny22 on Saturday August 03, 2019 @05:59PM (#20602942)
nobody would describe that as humorous. You might wanna try again without if if you want a decent response.