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Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by wwweston on Saturday June 08, 2019 @06:43PM (#20135696)
I really like studying. Like, my list of things to learn more about in CS/software engineering/Math alone is probably longer than I'm going to get to before retirement... which, if I'm lucky, will consist in no small part of studying things and working on personal projects. I don't understand people who say they don't want to be immortal, they'd get bored. I can sortof imagine my psyche eventually crushing itself under the weight of its own history but... boredom? Nope. Too much interesting stuff to learn/try, even at the scale of challenge available to us now.

So, trust me when I say I don't object in the slightest to being asked to study and learn things. LeetCode-style problems look like one form of recreation to me.

And yet, I still think this comment is shortsighted because:

* I'd guess a lot of what's on LeetCode isn't exactly untrodden territory for any developer that got their start before 1995.

* Distinguishing oneself can work in the individual case, but it generalizes poorly. Imagine employers and would-be job-seekers alike internalize LeetCode knowledge as a standard distinguishing mark. Like college degrees, distinguishing points often over time become standard expectations. The likely outcome is that about as many devs in their 20s & 30s can brandish the same "distinction" that devs 40+ can and the incentives to prefer youth perform about the same.

Individual efforts to improve ones lot are a good place to start, but they rarely solve systemic problems.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by scarface74 on Saturday June 08, 2019 @10:23PM (#20136630)
I can guarantee you that someone knowing leetCode and algorithms would be absolutely useless where I work.

Most developers are doing CRUD apps or at most apps where the complexity is in the business rules and process.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by ineedasername on Sunday June 09, 2019 @12:17AM (#20137084)
>Business rules & process:

Absolutely. Unless you're working on a greenfield project or refactoring code for extreme performance, understanding the operational side of the business will get you more points towards the mythical 10x programmer status than algorithms.

I can't count the times I've seen scope creep and deadline slippage because the developer didn't really understand the need & use case and built something other than what was required.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by scarface74 on Sunday June 09, 2019 @12:38AM (#20137148)
One of the most valuable skills is recognizing an XY Problem and digging deeper.
Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by mykowebhn on Saturday June 08, 2019 @11:42PM (#20136964)
This is curious to me, and it's not just in your comment that I've seen this.

But why is there this assumption that if someone studies Leetcode and algorithms then it means that they can't do anything else? Why is there this all or nothing mentality?

If someone studies Leetcode and algorithms, wouldn't one assume they know other things as well in the software engineering realm? I have plenty of friends in the Bay Area who are thriving at FAANG who studied algorithms and Leetcode intensely.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by aiisjustanif on Sunday June 09, 2019 @01:48AM (#20137377)
> I have plenty of friends in the Bay Area who are thriving at FAANG who studied algorithms and Leetcode intensely.

And I've seen developers come from doing Node green field APIs at Netflix to waist deep in a 15 year old Java application with Spring MVC and some underlying Struts yet to be removed and don't understand why debugger stopped going any deeper and they lost where they start 10 classes ago from shared modules.

Then they don't understand how refactoring a core message for alerting customer across the sight has tight coupling, wanted to something fancy and broke the key business features, try to argue it's better but a business unit just list functionality of it's product. Instead of researching, and coming up a plan with a team to refactor using TTD and Strangle Vine method from the legacy tightly coupled code, to a separate module with better testing and following SOLID principles.

Welcome to multiple Fortune 500 companies.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by scarface74 on Saturday June 08, 2019 @11:49PM (#20136985)
How much time have they spent using the standard frameworks that most companies use everyday? Could they even model a standard relational schema? Do they know anything about automated testing?

If they were told a web page was slow would they know enough architecturally to know how to find the bottleneck and no the solution for solving it? No the answer is not based on finding the o(n) complexity of reversing a binary tree.

Re:New Evidence of Age Bias in Hiring, and a Push to Fight It by matz1 on Sunday June 09, 2019 @12:44AM (#20137175)
>No the answer is not based on finding the o(n) complexity of reversing a binary tree.

Of course not, the main purpose of the leetcode is to ace the interview.

Doesn't mean they do not know any of those questions you mentioned above.

I, for example, did all you mentioned above and also practicing leetcode.