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Re:$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now by jancsika on Friday March 01, 2019 @01:51PM (#19284059)
> In other words I want the dealer to optimise for that variable and as long as they meet my constraint for affording the down and monthly payments then I don't care how those vary as long as the optimisation goal is met.

But you would have already told them, "As long as I can afford..." So they'll spend the entire exchange trying to optimize for the maximum amount they think you can afford. They can try to convince you they've optimized when they really haven't, and they can try to pick a vehicle of a lower quality and persuade you that the price drop is the optimization.

If your response to every trick is to respond, "No, please try again to optimize for TCO," they'll eventually interpret your behavior as the equivalent of an ad-blocker. Then they'll either persuade you to reveal more data or move on to a customer who negotiates on their terms.

Re:$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now by chrisseaton on Friday March 01, 2019 @02:28PM (#19284407)
I don’t understand how you think it’s any different - you ask ‘can you reduce the price for the paint finish’ and I ask ‘can you reduce the bottom line price’. In both cases it’s the same reduction in their profit margin. Why do a dance around which line item it supposedly comes off?
Re:$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now by 1123581321 on Saturday March 02, 2019 @05:36PM (#19291566)
Because they will say no to your question and yes to jancsika’s question. We’ve given you some reasons why rhetorical/persuasive skill and willingness to work to find an angle on a negotiation improves the results.

There is a difference simply because the results are different, whether due to the need to save face, behavior psychology, sales training, or more intangible factors.

Re:$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now by jancsika on Monday March 04, 2019 @12:42PM (#19303249)
Just to be clear-- in reality the game is rigged by the dealership and salesperson such that it is extremely likely one will pay too much for the vehicle. Or at least the sale will not be optimized for TCO. And that is regardless of whether one plays the salesperson's game or tries to "beat the game."

What I'm saying is that either OP will accidentally give away information at the outset that virtually guarantees overpayment-- "Here's what I can afford"-- or robotically repeat a fair price calculated ahead of time and request TCO optimization until they are thrown out of the dealership.

It'd be like going to a shell game and requesting to pay $7 so your kid can have 10 guesses at where the shell is. Then when they ignore you, start asking what's wrong with that, I mean, those are the odds, no? I've even rounding up for that pure profit. Why wouldn't someone with a big crowd of good faith players want to accept that?

Re:$35,000 Tesla Model 3 Available Now by 1123581321 on Thursday March 07, 2019 @11:42AM (#19329498)
That makes sense — thank you.