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Re:Innovative Cultures by Nasrudith on Thursday February 14, 2019 @09:20AM (#19162006)
Stack ranking (or Amazon's lipstickes pig version) is also the opposite of a good policy as it literally encourages sabotage of peers instead of cooperation (you know what an /organization/ should do) and operates on very faulty assumptions - about incoming averages vs existing labor pool /when the actors know about it/. It is no wonder now that their phone line failed and Fire has been tepid.

It doesn't belong on a list of intolerance for incompetence - it /is/ incompetence on management's part.

Re:Innovative Cultures by AlexTWithBeard on Thursday February 14, 2019 @09:50AM (#19162236)
I've been through my fair share of forced rankings on both sides of the barrier. Despite of all my skepticism, the whole experience was pretty reasonable:

- in small teams quotas are enforced pretty loosely. Everybody understands that in a team of five engineers all five can be good and smart

- on the other hand, everybody understands that out of hundred people in the department there will be a couple of underperformers.

- a department head may claim that all his one hundred people are brilliant, but extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence

- usually there is a surprising consensus about who belongs to where. Yes, there are occasional clashes between the managers about whose guy is "brilliant" and whose is "exceptionally brilliant", but I've never ever seen a smart person being force ranked into a "bad" bucket

Re:Innovative Cultures by whatshisface on Thursday February 14, 2019 @09:53AM (#19162256)
>the whole experience was pretty reasonable: in small teams quotas are enforced pretty loosely.

Any set of rules can appear reasonable in practice when people ignore the rules when their results would be unreasonable.

Re:Innovative Cultures by ThrowawayR2 on Thursday February 14, 2019 @12:03PM (#19163483)
> on the other hand, everybody understands that out of hundred people in the department there will be a couple of underperformers.

That's the theory. In practice, what happens is that underpeformers who are good at puffing up their accomplishments or people who maintain good relationships with managers get ranked higher than people who are performing at an average level but are working on unexciting projects or are less capable of selling themselves (e.g. introverts or shy people).

Re:Innovative Cultures by vonmoltke on Thursday February 14, 2019 @11:15AM (#19163013)
> - in small teams quotas are enforced pretty loosely. Everybody understands that in a team of five engineers all five can be good and smart

Not at a couple of the companies I have worked for. Small teams were still expected to have average ratings that were close to the company-wide average.

Re:Innovative Cultures by maxxxxx on Thursday February 14, 2019 @11:32AM (#19163167)
Same here. You can’t have a team with only “outstanding” score. You have to fit your team into the standard distribution. Even if one team is much better than the other, their average still has to be the same.
Re:Innovative Cultures by ip26 on Thursday February 14, 2019 @11:40AM (#19163245)
Unless you then proceed to rank the teams and use a team modifier, that's pretty irrational.
Re:Innovative Cultures by marcosdumay on Thursday February 14, 2019 @03:19PM (#19165587)
> on the other hand, everybody understands that out of hundred people in the department there will be a couple of underperformers

The law of large numbers only works when the sample is unbiased. If the stack ranking was working as intended to any degree or the hiring procedures have any quality, no team will be composed of random people.

So, if that statement holds for your company (I doubt it), then both hiring managers are completely incompetent, and the rank process is completely ineffective.

Re:Innovative Cultures by ip26 on Thursday February 14, 2019 @11:38AM (#19163216)
Reportedly, it's when you also fire the bottom 10% on the spot and repeat the process every 12 or perhaps 6 months that it becomes pathological.
Re:Innovative Cultures by throwawaymath on Thursday February 14, 2019 @09:38AM (#19162133)
> It is no wonder now that their phone line failed and Fire has been tepid.

Your general point may be true, but using examples of specific products like this is really unconvincing. Amazon is one of the most valuable and successful companies in the world. How do you counter the phenomenal success of Amazon.com, Amazon Web Services and the Amazon Echo?

Frankly, I think most companies wish they could be "incompetent" enough to have the smash hits that Amazon does.

Re:Innovative Cultures by ThrowawayR2 on Thursday February 14, 2019 @11:58AM (#19163416)
> Stack ranking ... is also the opposite of a good policy as it literally encourages sabotage of peers instead of cooperation

Sabotage is the wrong word. I would say more that it rewards doing things that are flashy and look good (which can involve cooperation with like-minded ambitious peers) than boring but important stuff that keeps the business running. There's little "sabotage" in an active sense because if it gets perceived as such, it will backfire onto the saboteur. What's more likely to happen is people not bothering to help out others where it doesn't advance their own interests even if it's the right thing to do for the team or the business.