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Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by TorKlingberg on Sunday February 03, 2019 @02:05PM (#19071479)
I find it strange how all the comments here are blaming Google. Isn't it obvious that CAPTCHAs have gotten difficult because AI got better at solving them? Soon bots will be better than humans at solving CAPTCHAs, and the system will fail completely. I predict that then Google and Facebook will completely block new user signup from Tor, VPNs or browsers without cookines. Everyone else will require an existing Google, Facebook or similar account to create an account.
Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by Pharmakon on Sunday February 03, 2019 @03:57PM (#19072150)
We hate them for the same reason we hate airport security theater; they do not work and have a high burden on the people being subjected to them. Plus, as it’s Google doing it, you can hardly escape the goddamned things. So yeah, we blame Google for using us as data classifiers and adding hoops and hurdles to the open net, while accomplishing precisely dick.

I for one hope that AI gets to the point that it can effortlessly beat them, so we can stop dealing with them.

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by hombre_fatal on Sunday February 03, 2019 @05:35PM (#19072683)
> We hate them for the same reason we hate airport security theater; they do not work

Well, they absolutely do work. They work so well that they've reduced bot actions by almost 100% on our sites.

We wouldn't use Recaptcha if there wasn't abuse on the internet. But, unfortunately, there is. There is a sobering amount of it.

I'm actually curious about all these posts suggesting that websites use Recaptcha for no real reason or for some trivial reason. To me, it suggests a massive misunderstanding that people have about the internet.

It's certainly something to worry about, but how about this angle: abuse is getting so cheap and hard to prevent that we're electing the aid of complicated systems engineered by large corporations like Google. That scares me, but not from a Google=bad standpoint. It indicates that the internet has fundamental problems that make abuse trivial, and that's a different discussion worth having, but it's a much harder one than Google=bad. Probably less cathartic, too.

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by syrrim on Sunday February 03, 2019 @07:41PM (#19073152)
The false negative rate may be very low, this doesn't speak to the false postive rate. Considering the goal was supposed to be "telling humans and computers apart" both kinds of errors are important to consider. Google predicates their captcha primarily on the logged-in user's activity around the web, failing that they use the ip. A human being not logged in and using an open proxy is likely to get shut out completely. It ceases to be a captcha, in the traditional sense, at that point. This may be a good thing, depending on your standpoint.
Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by hombre_fatal on Sunday February 03, 2019 @07:58PM (#19073207)
Sure, but that should be a chilling reminder of how bad abuse is on the internet.

Obviously it comes with downsides, but it's a trade-off. Nobody uses Recaptcha for fun.

As I reminded a sibling comment, even HN uses Recaptcha on its login/register page. There's no telling how many fewer spambots we have to deal with every day because of it, yet we're somehow here discussing whether Recaptcha servers a purpose while profiting from it. :)

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by Pharmakon on Sunday February 03, 2019 @06:16PM (#19072853)
Well, they absolutely do work. They work so well that they've reduced bot actions by almost 100% on our sites. We wouldn't use Recaptcha if there wasn't abuse on the internet. But, unfortunately, there is. There is a sobering amount of it. I'm actually curious about all these posts suggesting that websites use Recaptcha for no real reason or for some trivial reason. To me, it suggests a massive misunderstanding that people have about the internet.

Or we’ve just managed to notice that CAPTCHAs don’t seem to keep millions of bots, spammers, dummy accounts, shills, etc off the net. I’m glad you’re having such perceived success, but it’s not a universal phenomenon.

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by hombre_fatal on Sunday February 03, 2019 @07:47PM (#19073175)
Captchas do do that. They can't do everything, but they are an incredibly powerful tool.

Do you run a service that needs to prevent abuse at scale? What exactly is your Recaptcha replacement?

It's very easy to complain about the inconvenience of Recaptcha, but I'd like to see less of that and more constructive conversation about what all these supposed alternatives are, because all I see is "you don't need it" which is merely a reminder that, understandably, most people aren't running sites at a scale that attract abuse.

Even HN uses Recaptcha. Check out the login/register page.

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by CM30 on Sunday February 03, 2019 @02:46PM (#19071754)
It's not even bots that are breaking them much of the time. The spammers just get people in third world countries/using mechanical turk type services to break them. Captchas like this cannot stop a human determined to break the rules.
Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by hombre_fatal on Sunday February 03, 2019 @05:56PM (#19072773)
Right, but eliminating all attackers except the ones who are willing to spend money on human labor is an incredibly strong filter.
Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by csydas on Sunday February 03, 2019 @02:14PM (#19071527)
I think the main thrust is that the tool is not fit for purpose, but Google benefits from it anyways. They get the AI training data, but the website owners still get hammered by bots, and privacy conscious users and users who have the audacity to be from a country flagged by RECAPTCHA get to struggle. Living in Russia at the moment, I almost prefer the sites that just outright block me to the stupid RECAPTCHA that cycles me through 3-4 iterations of images only to ask me to try again.

RECAPTCHA is no longer doing what it promised, and that's the general thrust of the article; the bots are just getting too good for it.

Re:Why Captchas have gotten so difficult by grenadier21 on Monday February 04, 2019 @01:10AM (#19074311)
It's not that, it's the fact that Google asks you almost never if you're using a Google account. That pretty much gives Google-account-havers a fast pass to the Internet, which gives Google even more power that it really shouldn't have. Also, they're using the captchas to train their AIs, which is unfair extraction of labor.