I'd argue the actions suggest complexity with both a lot of good and bad which the history of any large group of people is going to have - it isn't binary. The government is also not one entity acting in unison, it's a lot of people with different goals trying to do different things.

That said, the core goals and ideas that countries stand for are vastly different between western representative democracies like the US, UK and religious theocracies like the UAE, KSA (or kleptocratic governments like Russia). I think this is an important difference.

The pragmatic approach is given the need for intelligence organizations to exist it's important for good people to work there and try to do the right thing.

Opting out and implying that any moral person would have to act similarly leads to a government of the worst people and it kind of abandons the principle goals of representative democracy. It's not the pointing out of bad behavior that's virtue signaling, it's the side stepping of the difficulty of the issue - how do you actually solve these kinds of complex problems?

The goals you mention between the governments you spoke are indeed different. This is not an unimportant point. I believe you are correct in that. I don’t claim that there are no moral people working for American intelligence agencies. I don’t claim there are only immoral people working for UAE intelligence. What I do claim is that I don’t look down on people doing dirty shit for UAE while not looking down on similar bad actors for American intelligence. What I do claim is that over the last 50 years or so the distinction between UAE and the U.S. in terms of governmental morality has blurred and I no longer see the U.S. government as a one deserving of support or the benefit of the doubt.

"the distinction between UAE and the U.S. in terms of governmental morality has blurred"

But imagine UAE or KSA by the will of Allah get the military and economic power of the US?

What would they be doing?

Bombing and sanctioning countries until they convert to their particular brand of Islam and accept sharia law?

I'd bet the distinction will get unblurred pretty quickly.

We do just that but for a set of beliefs that are not religious.

I think we actually agree on most things then.

I think bad actors in both places should be viewed negatively and be accountable for bad things they do. I do think risk is higher in a place with fewer rules (or bad laws), but that's more of a separate thing.

I'm generally suspicious of giving any powerful group the benefit of the doubt - it's good to be skeptical.

Our main difference is that I think the US government is still worth supporting (even if the current administration is absolutely not). I also see a significant difference between the US and the UAE.

Anyway - I appreciate the nuanced discussion, thanks.

But how comes that Western democracies with all their core goals and ideas and the moral high ground are the best friends with KSA and selling it weapons worth tens of billions of dollars? Enabling the war in the Yemen among other things.

What are these goals and ideas worth?