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Re:Remind HN: Vote by kelnos on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @07:25AM (#1859970)
Remember that you don't vote to make a difference, you vote because it's your obligation to do so.

That's crap. Why should I feel obligated to do something that has no affect on anything?

(I'm not saying that's definitively the case, but your statement implies that you should vote even if your vote doesn't matter. Why?)

Re:Remind HN: Vote by mynameishere on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @08:13AM (#1860080)
I'm not saying that's definitively the case

It is definitely the case. In the rare instance when the vote is decided by one, rest assured a judge, and not the one, will settle the actual result. Voting is an absolutely pointless pyschological approval of two candidates, neither of whom was chosen democratically.

If anyone is actually interested in influencing policy, which is the whole point, get out your checkbook. Or, if you have a lot of time, get involved in the machinery of politics.

Re:Remind HN: Vote by jsz0 on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @09:19AM (#1860284)
Local elections are very democratic. It's winner take all. None of this electoral college non-sense. The best opportunity an individual has to influence elections is to vote in the primaries but few people bother to show up. You'll have the choice of a dozen candidates or more -- most of whom have a very legitimate shot at getting the nomination. It's common for primaries to be decided by only a couple hundred votes because so few people show up to vote. For the general election you have less choices but, at the local level, it's still winner takes all democracy. There are always third parties and/or write-ins if you don't want to vote for the two major parties. In many places we have referendums or propositions on the ballot which offer the most direct form of democracy

The argument people make about their votes 'not counting' is like an individual choosing not to join the basketball team because they might not hit the winning shot. Every point counts. I don't understand the extreme egotism that people would opt not to participate unless they get to cast the deciding vote. Talk about un-democratic? Some people want their votes to be more than equal apparently. It goes back to people complaining about the two party system and doing absolutely nothing to help third parties.

Re:Remind HN: Vote by Semiapies on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @07:00PM (#1862795)
It's the "extreme egotism" that involves not being interested in giving your team points just because you keep barking at me that I'm "obligated" to do so.
Re:Remind HN: Vote by jozo on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @08:21AM (#1860109)
Your vote rarely matter from an individual perspective, but there are still reasons for voting.

1. You vote out of solidarity to the people in a similar situation as you are and to represent that perspective on issues. If you feel strongly about something you would want others with the same perspective to also take part.

2. You vote as a role model for your friends and family and to give them a fair chance to cast their vote. If you don't set a good example for others, e.g. your kids, they're not going to have a fair chance to choose if they want to vote or not.

3. You vote to show support for a system where people have the right to vote, even if it's flawed. It's also out of respect to those who fought and those who continue to fight for the right to vote.

4. You vote to consistently show that you cannot be manipulated to not express your opinion. For instance moving election dates, changing locations of polling stations, saying that you shouldn't vote if you not informed etc.

5. You vote to question your own motives not to vote. If you have the conviction not to vote, then there shouldn't be a reason not to go through the voting process and casting either a blank/invalid vote or choosing not to vote at the absolute last moment. If you can't do this it's more likely that you are abstaining from voting out of convenience, not conviction.

What I find strange is that people generally don't seem to have a problem with offering their opinion outside of elections, not least on the Internet. I guess it has to do with having higher expectations when it comes to elections.

Democracy is based on people stepping up, coming together and making their voice heard. Voting was never meant to reflect the opinions of an individual, but rather the opinions of a movement.

Re:Remind HN: Vote by jasonkester on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @08:29AM (#1860128)
1. You vote out of solidarity to the group of people who share your situation, faith, occupation etc. If you felt strongly about something you would want others who agreed to also take part.

Please don't do that. If you're going to vote, do it about things you care about after having considered all sides, and without first checking whether it's the way everybody around you is voting.

Re:Remind HN: Vote by jozo on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @09:00AM (#1860222)
I clarified a bit what I meant in my post before I realized you had replied. I'm not talking about asking your friends what they want, but representing your perspective based on your situation, education, background etc. As an example, most people here have a unique perspective on technology based on those factors. I'm not very familiar with how elections work in the US, but if possible I would rather people here voted for someone technology friendly than not at all.
Re:Remind HN: Vote by jasonkester on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @09:13AM (#1860266)
I think we're clear on what you're saying. And I still think it's a bad thing.

Vote on a case-by-case basis, without bias from your group or political party. Or please don't vote.

Re:Remind HN: Vote by jozo on Tuesday November 02, 2010 @10:30AM (#1860531)
I'm sorry but I frankly don't get what you are saying. Democracies are generally based on representation, where you elect someone to represent your values and what's important to you. I don't know how you would do this without taking your previous experiences into account. I also don't get where you got bias from group or political party from. The group I referred to wasn't an actual group, but a representation of people with similar experiences. I'm not saying these people will come to the same conclusion based on those experience, but they still represent a shared part of what is going on in society.

I would understand if you said that people should stay informed, but asking people not to vote seems undemocratic to me. Democracies are still supposed to be a reflection of the people. Not a reflection of those who had the opportunity to evaluate every issue without consideration of previous experiences. It seems to me you're blaming voters for something that is the responsibility of politicians. As a voter you have the right to vote even if you're wrong. I can't really make my point any clearer than this without seeming condescending, so this will be my last post in this exchange.