Re:The world is not an engineering problem
by cirgue on Thursday November 08, 2018 @03:52PM
(#18409906)
I disagree that joy is superior to pain. They’re both necessary parts of life and one without the other is indistinguishable from oblivion. Plenty of people would disagree about alive/animate versus dead/inanimate and in ways that would probably surprise you. I like mountains, I think they’re certainly more interesting and beautiful than pigeons. As for “murder is bad”, plenty of people disagree vehemently about the definition of murder. Is killing to defend someone else murder? What about killing someone during war time? Those aren’t even close to being settled issues and are absolutely matters of belief that are not provable in any scientific sense.
Re:The world is not an engineering problem
by MereInterest on Friday November 09, 2018 @12:18AM
(#18412491)
I think the distinction is a useful one to have, because it lets you identify the appropriate way to try to convince somebody. If people disagree about the effectiveness of policies, and which ones will bring about the desired effects, then additional evidence should be found and examined to determine who is correct. On the other hand, if people disagree about what the goal is, then no amount of evidence will convince them, because goals are unobservable.
We already do this in a quite literal way with money, the price of things follows the subjective valuation of those things, so for example if a bit of paint on canvas in a frame which would otherwise only be worth $40 is the Mona Lisa, then it is suddenly (and seemingly magically) worth $800 million. You could use this to evaluate joy and harm as well, in the form "what is the maximum amount of money you would spend to be able to eliminate this harm or to experience this joy?"