This.

WhatsApp is much worse. Here in Europe we use it like TOO MUCH. We just can't switch to Signal, we need it to text/chat friends, people we don't know yet, businesses, etc.

Why do you think WhatsApp usage is worse than IG and FB? (honestly asking).

While I’ve no doubts that people at FB are actively thinking about ways to monetize it, right now the product doesn’t seem to contain any of the toxic crap from IG/FB (ie: algorithmic timelines, attention-grabing dark patterns, promoted content, etc).

I’m wondering if it’s somehow already there and I simply haven’t noticed :(

Because WhatsApp is part of Facebook and I don’t trust Facebook. It’s that simple. People act like they are different companies. You can’t use WhatsApp and then be intellectually honest when you criticize Facebook. They are one and the same. The goal with #deleteFacebook isn’t to stop using Facebook, but to diminish the power and nastiness of Facebook the company. You can’t do that if you are using WhatsApp: you are feeding the same beast.

It's all about what briandear has pointed out: it's Facebook.

I simply don't trust Facebook. I know WhatsApp doesn't contain any of that "toxic crap" (yet), I know WhatsApp is e2e encrypted and as a developer I really know what it does mean, but it's just too much power for a single company..

The worst part of WhatsApp is that it seems to be designed to maximize contact. People will add you to groups, and you can't do anything about it. Suddenly your number is distributed with many others, who may have who knows what data collection apps on their phones...

And once in, you will be forced to either leave and offend people, or stay and bear the consequences.

I wish I could remove it, but as you say, everyone depends on it.

Curious to know where in Europe WhatsApp is mandatory for contacting businesses.

Here in the UK I never ever saw a legitimate business advertising a WhatsApp contact number.

> We just can't switch to Signal, we need it to text/chat friends

Doesn't SMS (or iMessage) work? Especially in Europe where unlimited SMS plans are commonplace.

Yeah, medium to big companies don't advertise a WhatsApp contact number but local businesses do. With the new WhatsApp Business API I'm pretty sure this will change in the near future.

Texts are fine, but as I said above, there're good reasons to not use SMS:

> (1) 0 encryption (2) ISP's full control (3) Doesn't support videocalls (4) Doesn't support neither complex files nor previewing files (5) Doesn't support groups (6) Doesn't support voice messages (7) There're plans which don't include texts so they're not always free

And as I mentioned earlier, here in Spain if you don't have WhatsApp you're literally isolated. I end up using WhatsApp + iMessage but I just.. can't quit WhatsApp.

To sum up, I think it's much harder to ditch WhatsApp than Facebook itself and WhatsApp is too much power for a single company, that's my point :)

Cross-platform rich content over SMS is a bit of a mixed bag. You’re never sure the other party is going to be able to read it properly.

Also SMS doesn’t do group messenging very well.

iMessage would be a great alternative to WA were it cross platform. In EU especially, you’re bound to have a critical mass of your contacts on Android :/

I think that may depend on where in Europe. I don’t know a single Dane on WhatsApp. There no point to WhatsApp when SMS is basically free.

Well, I do have danish friends which use WhatsApp a lot, but I guess you're right. Here in Spain you must have WhatsApp. Otherwise, you're literally isolated. I have free texts too but we don't use them at all. Also, it may worth mentioning they're not even encrypted and ISPs have full control on them.

So at the end of the day there're good reasons to not use SMS:

(1) 0 encryption (2) ISP's full control (3) Doesn't support videocalls (4) Doesn't support neither complex files nor previewing files (5) Doesn't support groups (6) Doesn't support voice messages (7) There're plans which don't include texts so they're not always free

The only apps I use here are WhatsApp and iMessage and I'd love to ditch WhatsApp in favour of signal but I can't.