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Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by 01100011 on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @05:24PM (#17612975)
Does modern space exploration still produce the same kinds of spin-off benefits as the old school 'big space' programs did(say, up until the 80s)?

Could we get the same kinds of spin-off technologies if we reallocated NASA's budget to prioritize technology development over, say, planetary exploration?

I'm not anti-space... and I think it's important for us, as a society, to reach for the heavens. I also think, however, that it would not hold humanity back much in the grand scheme of things if we stopped exploring planets for, say, the next 50-100 years.

Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by AnthonyMouse on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @06:22PM (#17613462)
> Could we get the same kinds of spin-off technologies if we reallocated NASA's budget to prioritize technology development over, say, planetary exploration?

Not really. The private sector is really good at technology development, i.e. take an idea and figure out how to mass produce it at low cost.

What you want government funding for is fundamental research. Which space is good at because of the constraints.

Normally if you can't fit your payload on the truck, you send a second truck. That costs another $100, so it's not worth it to you to spend ten million dollars to figure out how to make it work with one truck, even if you figuring out will save a hundred million other people a hundred dollars each.

With space, you can't just send another ten billion dollar rocket, so you do the ten million in research and actually solve the problem, and we get the piece of new technology that everybody can also use for other things.

"Necessity is the mother of invention." It's hot, it's cold, it's far away, adding a kilo costs nine kilos of rocket fuel, oxygen is scarce, gravity is different, etc. You need the constraints to force an invention instead of just suffering the status quo and covering for the inefficiency with brute force.

Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by 01100011 on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @07:01PM (#17613723)
Maybe you misunderstood me or I wasn't clear. What I'm saying is to let NASA keep the money but shift focus towards general technological development, ala Australia's CSIRO. NASA's budget is relatively tiny, especially when compared to the military industrial complex(sure, a lot of that is just benefits for troops, but still).
Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by AnthonyMouse on Thursday July 26, 2018 @01:41AM (#17615290)
> What I'm saying is to let NASA keep the money but shift focus towards general technological development, ala Australia's CSIRO.

You actually have to go to Mars or there is no impetus to invent the technology required to go to Mars.

Without that you have two problems.

The first is that there is no goal, so nobody knows what to work towards, so you get undirected research that never goes anywhere. This is the problem the NIH and NSF have -- they fund a lot of research and 5% of it is brilliant but 95% of it is not.

The second is that there are other goals, but they're pedestrian. So there is money and somebody figures out how to divert it to their own business, and it ends up funding research that would have otherwise been done by the private sector if those companies' lobbyists hadn't figured out how to get the government to foot the bill instead. Which doesn't grow the pie at all, it just transfers tax money to well-heeled companies with good lobbyists.

Plus, I mean, we get to go to Mars. How is that not awesome enough to justify <1% of the federal budget? Spend a different <1% of the federal budget on the thing you wanted.

Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by toomanybeersies on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @10:19PM (#17614630)
That's basically what DARPA is, isn't it? Except that DARPA is focussed towards military applications.
Re:Liquid water 'lake' revealed on Mars by aeternus on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @06:20PM (#17613455)
Human effort, passion, and drive are highly dependent on belief in a shared vision and end goal. You're likely to get much more effort out of a team if the end goal is to find a thermal material that can survive Mars re-entry vs. a thermal material that can make some industrial process 5% more efficient.

Effort isn't necessarily a zero-sum game, and necessity as the mother of invention has some truth to it.