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Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by dewitt on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:44PM (#17602736)
Thanks to everyone who played a part of this! The Google team is also watching this thread. Happy to answer any questions people have.
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by otterley on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @02:48PM (#17603865)
Can we see a design document/theory of operations, please? It’s difficult to evaluate this effort without understanding exactly what it is - namely, the constituent components, their respective functions, how they work and relate to one another, etc.

Just a comment here about this in general - given all the resources at Google’s disposal, I’m perplexed as to why we don’t see world-class (or even at least halfway decent) documentation being shipped along with the product at first release. As a community I think we need to demand higher standards in this area. If GNU can do it, Google certainly can.

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by dewitt on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @03:38PM (#17604238)
Is this something like what you're looking for?

https://github.com/knative/serving/blob/master/docs/spec/ove...

Or a little higher-level:

https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1CbwVC7W2JaSxRyltU8CS...

There are a lot of technical docs in the individual repositories. You can get started, for example, with the serving docs under:

https://github.com/knative/serving/tree/master/docs

Same for the other repos, like build and eventing.

Thanks for asking!

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by otterley on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @03:55PM (#17604371)
Not really, I'm afraid. Resource descriptions don't constitute a theory of operations, and the higher-level document you linked to is not public.

By "theory of operations," I mean a design document, often but not always created before a line of code is written, that describes in plain English what is to be built (or, what was built). It often discusses things like:

* What problems are being solved?

* What attempts have already been made to solve the problem?

* How does it work? How do the components interrelate? How does one operate it, especially at scale?

* How does this solution solve the problems better than the alternatives?

There are lots of great examples out there. I like to point to Consul[1] as a textbook example of fantastic documentation, and it's been there since day 1. Google would do well to follow Hashicorp's and GNU's lead.

[1] https://www.consul.io

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by jsolson on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @12:22AM (#17606893)
I once had an interesting argument about Learning Perl.

The first chapter, when I picked up the book, was a tour of Perl. I loved it. It showed me all of the highlights with no details at all. I never read another chapter, and instead picked up the second book in the series to use as a reference.

My counter in this argument HATED that first chapter. They almost didn't read another one, because it put all of these examples in front of them with no depth. They thought the book would be much improved by removing that chapter.

I would have been bored to tears by the book this person wanted to read.

I'm not going anywhere in particular with this, except to say that the world takes all kinds. Sometimes docs don't exist simply because nobody realized someone else would find that shape of document useful, so they decided not to write it.

The docs I love may well be the docs you hate :)

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by labadav on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @07:23PM (#17605729)
Have you taken a look at the docs repo? https://github.com/knative/docs/blob/master/README.md

We have the high-level overview and deeper dive into the details for each of the components, install instructions and samples.

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by otterley on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @07:49PM (#17605858)
Yes, but they don't fit the description I discussed above. Or at least they're not organized in such a fashion.
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by xrd on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @05:52PM (#17605265)
Your doc is marked invite only, BTW.
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by jhabdas on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @03:33PM (#17604211)
So you found the Zipkin UI link in the Microsoft GitHub docs already?
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by dcosson on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:52PM (#17602808)
This looks really cool, I'll definitely be looking into it more closely when I get a chance.

Obviously this is a conflict of interest for Google, but just curious if you know of any plans in the works for being able to run this on AWS EKS? It's the obvious omission from the list of supported clouds on the installation page[0].

[0] https://github.com/knative/docs/tree/master/install

Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by markusthoemmes on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:54PM (#17602822)
If AWS EKS gives you access to kubectl or similar, it is probably trivial to setup. There shouldn't be any obvious roadblocks. Will be a great contribution to add to the guides!
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by csears on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @02:22PM (#17603688)
AWS EKS definitely does support kubectl, but requires the aws-iam-authenticator (formerly Heptio) to integrate with AWS IAM. Docs here: https://docs.aws.amazon.com/eks/latest/userguide/configure-k...
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by empath75 on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @03:10PM (#17604031)
There seems to be a problem with istio working on EKS, actually -- i'm getting a timeout to the sidecar injector: same issue as this: https://github.com/istio/old_issues_repo/issues/271
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by dewitt on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:58PM (#17602875)
I'd love to see a PR that documents Knative on EKS!
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by jacques_chester on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:55PM (#17602837)
I think PRs would be gladly accepted. But, in general, it should work fine with any conforming Kubernetes system.
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by jacques_chester on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @12:57PM (#17602871)
It's been a really interesting experience. Google's position as a catalyst made this level of cooperation possible.
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by dewitt on Tuesday July 24, 2018 @01:00PM (#17602908)
Huge thanks to Pivotal for being an amazing development partner. Pivotal's deep experience with enterprise customers and developing products like riff brought real-world knowledge and technical leadership to Knative early on. We're super grateful for the opportunity to have worked together on this!
Re:Knative – Kubernetes-based platform to manage modern serv... by pas on Wednesday July 25, 2018 @03:37AM (#17607506)
How serving works? Is it possible to use it with kong? (Or other ingress controllers?)