News for hackers. Stuff that matters.
Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by kazinator on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @11:32AM (#17498953)
The phrase "concentration camp" in the English language no longer has any literal meaning that is simply composed of "concentration" and "camp". It refers strictly to the WWII Nazi concentration camps.

Anyone using the phrase and then insisting that the literal meaning was intended is thoroughly disingenuous. That speaker or writer is deliberately using the loaded term in order to troll the intended audience with a crystal clear Nazi reference.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by snackbugs on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @11:58AM (#17499244)
Ideologically there is no difference to previous uses of the term. Historically it refers to concentration camps of the second Boer War where over 150,000 people died in camps which concentrated specific settler populations in a manner that made the thinning of their population a foregone conclusion.

If it evokes the use of the concept you dislike, rethink your moral stance on it. Not the phrasing of the concept.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by kazinator on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @12:55PM (#17499895)
It doesn't evoke; it denotes. Like "rain" refers to "water falling from the sky". Not a moral stance whatsoever.

The word for non-murderous concentration camps is "internment".

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by snackbugs on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @02:15PM (#17500727)
Not only is that historically incorrect, but it's also a confession of a tolerance for detaining a specific population on ideological, non-criminal pretenses.

"It's different when we do it."

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by kazinator on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @03:17PM (#17501241)
Is that so? So by this amazing reasoning, we should refer to both types of camps using the same term. Since the correct term is evidently "extermination camps" (see surrounding thread), that's what they should be called.

"Historically incorrect" is just a way of saying "presently correct". For instance "sensibility" is not a historically correct way of referring to a rational disposition. Historically, it meant what we today call "sensitivity".

Fuck historically correct; I live today, not in history.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by Jwarder on Wednesday July 11, 2018 @09:47AM (#17506805)
I'm totally confused by your argument here. The simple fact that myself and others posting here don't treat "concentration camps" totally equivalent to "Nazi extermination camps" seems like ipso facto proof that this is not a disingenuous distinction.
Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by foldr on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @12:24PM (#17499533)
The Nazi camps pertaining to the Holocaust are correctly called extermination camps, not concentration camps. Although e.g. Auschwitz is commonly referred to as a concentration camp, this is a euphemism, and the term is not considered correct by anyone writing seriously about the Holocaust.
Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by kazinator on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @12:54PM (#17499888)
That may be so, but you're referring to pedants and historians, not common usage.

It is not a euphimism; everyone knows that it refers to starvation and horrific murder and aren't using that word for the sake of masking this.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by foldr on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @01:28PM (#17500274)
The term is a euphemism because "concentration camp" just means a camp with a high density of people. The fact that people know what they're really referring to doesn't mean that the term isn't a euphemism. After all, the whole point of a euphemism is that people know what is really meant.

It's quite well known that "concentration camp" is not the correct term for the Nazi extermination camps.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by kazinator on Tuesday July 10, 2018 @02:04PM (#17500621)
Just like it's quite well known that "hacker" isn't the correct term for someone who breaks into computers.

All that remains is the small detail of convincing the public at large that they are using the word wrong.

Re:Thailand cave rescue: all 12 boys and coach successfully ... by foldr on Wednesday July 11, 2018 @06:01AM (#17505690)
As I said, it's pretty well known that Auschwitz and the other camps like it were extermination camps, not (merely) concentration camps. I mean, I'd count myself a member of the "public at large" in this context (I'm certainly no expert on the Holocaust or the surrounding history), and yet I still know what the correct term is. Anyone who has so much as looked at the Wikipedia article for Auschwitz or one of the other camps will know the correct term.